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964 Calipers - Brake upgrade for 3.2


REX

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Finally got round to having a look at the 964 calipers tonight. Mine still have the ears on where as I have already machined VT's. So I tried bolting mine up and the bottom hole is half a hole out. Am I right in thinking that the holes had been opened out on the Orange JG?

 

Twinny's

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Mine bolted on using the top hole

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Why do people use the 944t discs? If I am going to machine adaptors why not just work them around 3.2 discs? I've tried searching here and PP but can't turn up much. Did some reading a while ago and remember summat about pad overhang, but can't remember what :doh2:

 

I'm sure I'll have plenty more stupid questions as I go along.

 

Cheers in advance.

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Why do people use the 944t discs? If I am going to machine adaptors why not just work them around 3.2 discs? I've tried searching here and PP but can't turn up much. Did some reading a while ago and remember summat about pad overhang, but can't remember what :doh2:

Much thicker mate, 28mm (944t) vs 24mm (3.2) :ani_clapping: better heat dissipation (the main enemy of 911 brakes). No real point going to 964 calipers and then using 3.2 discs :rolleyes:

Edited by GaryH
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Cheers lads, thought it may be a heat thing. Didn't know if it was thickness or diameter. The main concern is the supply of one year only (86?) discs, will they be readily available and for how long.

 

Matt, are there any other discs with a similar offset? Also why run the (6mm?) Behind the bearings? If you are machining brackets anyway why not just account for it there.

 

Don't know if these are stupid questions was fiddling about in the dark and cold(QOTY?)

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Cheers lads, thought it may be a heat thing. Didn't know if it was thickness or diameter. The main concern is the supply of one year only (86?) discs, will they be readily available and for how long.

 

Matt, are there any other discs with a similar offset? Also why run the (6mm?) Behind the bearings? If you are machining brackets anyway why not just account for it there.

 

Don't know if these are stupid questions was fiddling about in the dark and cold(QOTY?)

The spacers there to stop the disc clouting the strut due to the extra thickness.

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Good work Chris :ani_clapping: there's a load of info on this on PP. Will dig it out and post the links.

 

Must just be me, tried PP search and couldn't turn owt up. Would be helpful mate. Won't get another chance to look until Sunday now.

 

I have a cunning plan to eliminate those bearing spacers though.

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I think its the thickness of the discs that matters in the calipers! You would shims behind the pads to get them to touch the discs

 

I dont think there will be a problem in supply, its just a rare old bird and stock isnt huge, I think they will still be available easily enough

 

ATE list all the discs sizes, I dont know what is the same, something for you to do on those long winter nights!

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Must just be me, tried PP search and couldn't turn owt up. Would be helpful mate. Won't get another chance to look until Sunday now.

 

I have a cunning plan to eliminate those bearing spacers though.

A quick search yields :) :

 

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-911...grade-page.html

 

This is what you're emulating Chris.

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See KTL's pic about 3 post up from the bottom which covers the spacer issue spacer

From that post:

 

Originally Posted by 911st

..I have been hearing the SP911 guys are leaving the 930 set up behind for C2 front and 3.2 rear calipers both on 24mm rotors for the lower weight. There reported balance has been very good without and adjustable system.

"That is a fine setup as far as bias goes but you are not gaining much performance, it is simple to do, any***** can hog out the mounting holes and voila, instant BBK, but as I said you haven't gained much, yes you have more pad area, but that does not lower pad or rotor temps, it does reduce the unit pressure on the pads and rotors but that isn't a problem."

Edited by GaryH
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Without having the exact sizes to hand, the 951 disc is also nearly 300mm diameter versus the 280 mm 3.2 disc. To put it another way, you are gaining length and girth - who says size doesn't matter?

 

On the disc availability front, if there comes a time when you cannot get the 86 951, then you have 2 Porsche options - First use a 964 disc and machine the hub to fit inside the 964 disc. Second, go 930 disc on flat mounting bell like Jev. There are also likely to be Brembo and Alcon racing discs that would work.

 

While I couldn't swear to it (because I haven't checked), I thought the 86 951 disc was also common to some 944S2s and 968s. They certainly use a ~300mmx28mm disc.

 

Re the bearing spacer, the clearance on the bottom of the strut is really tight even with the spacer. If there is a better mousetrap then go for it, but my brakes do work very well and its the tried and tested VCI route that must now be on plenty of cars including on Chris Streit's race car for a few years. I tried my best at Snet last time to put VT through the front screen - as he will attest.

 

Edit - its 298x28mm for the 951s and 282.5x24mm on the 3.2 front and 290x24 on the 3.2 rear (just for completeness)

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Re the bearing spacer, the clearance on the bottom of the strut is really tight even with the spacer. If there is a better mousetrap then go for it, but my brakes do work very well and its the tried and tested VCI route that must now be on plenty of cars including on Chris Streit's race car for a few years. I tried my best at Snet last time to put VT through the front screen - as he will attest.

If in doubt, look at what RB has done and then mercilessly copy him ! :whistling: I know he loves being the front-runner/test mule for the rest of us ;) We appreciate it RB, honestly :ani_clapping:

 

3.2 discs are 24mm, 951 discs are 28mm, as are 964................ :ani_nerd:

Maybe we should try to organise a group discount from Type911 on the 944T front discs ? :whistling:

Edited by GaryH
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I tried my best at Snet last time to put VT through the front screen - as he will attest.

Yep I can confirm RB's car does not lack stopping power!

 

Chris: any thoughts of re engineering the brake duct inserts to work with this set-up to get some proper cooling in there too?

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Yep I can confirm RB's car does not lack stopping power!

 

Chris: any thoughts of re engineering the brake duct inserts to work with this set-up to get some proper cooling in there too?

I'm going with the 993 scoops before I try anything else. Another RB mod ;)

 

P621067111123048471231180995.jpg

 

Cheep and effective (if I eat my Wheaties and tie them on properly)

Edited by GaryH
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3.2 front-

 

Fitting Position: Front Axle

Ø: 282,5 mm, Br. Disc Thickness: 24,0 mm, Min. thickness: 22,6 mm, Brake Disc Type: Vented, Num. of holes: 5, Finish: Alloyed / High-carbon

 

944T 1986 front-

 

Fitting Position: Front Axle

To MY: 12/1986

Ø: 298 mm, Br. Disc Thickness: 28,0 mm, Min. thickness: 26 mm, Brake Disc Type: Vented, Num. of holes: 5, Finish: Alloyed / High-carbon

 

The ones I supplied VT & Chris were Sebro

 

Sebro have 2 sets (4 discs) left in the UK, I can do them for £55 each as a deal on 4

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The ones I supplied VT & Chris were Sebro

Splitters ! bang goes my group buy ;)

 

Sebro have 2 sets (4 discs) left in the UK, I can do them for £55 each as a deal on 4

Is that including the dreaded Matt ?

Edited by GaryH
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Yep I can confirm RB's car does not lack stopping power!

 

Chris: any thoughts of re engineering the brake duct inserts to work with this set-up to get some proper cooling in there too?

 

Experienced it myself at Spa. Cooling ducts are already inhand VT.

 

Had a look at that site Matt, its the offsets I need really. Didn't know there was an option to use 930 or 964 discs. I'll have a thourough read of the links ce soir.

 

Tried copying RB's but couldn't get the feckers off. Is this spacer ally or steel?

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Splitters ! bang goes my group buy ;)

 

 

Is that including the dreaded Matt ?

 

 

We can overcome Mr Darlings input on this transaction............ :rolleyes:

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We can overcome Mr Darlings input on this transaction............ :rolleyes:

Cool, so all I need now is someone else who wants a pair of 944Turbo front discs ?

 

Had a look at that site Matt, its the offsets I need really. Didn't know there was an option to use 930 or 964 discs. I'll have a thourough read of the links ce soir.

I think you have to open up the caliper throats for 930 discs (30+ mm ?) IIRC

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