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987 BoxsterS 3.2


Richard Bernau

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@Richard Bernau - looks great, wheels suit it too.  Roof down, engine rung out and a great road - bliss.

Another way to really wake the car up is to install a lightweight flywheel - something that's pretty obvious but a bit too hardcore for many (virtually all) Boxster drivers and as such it doesn't get flagged very often.  I had one on mine which was temporarily removed as part of a ongoing project, it's being reinstalled when the bigger engine goes back in.

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Agreed - LWFW and/or pressure plate and LSD when/if the clutch needs replacing.  Would be great, as the revs hang a bit when you are changing gear at high revs and I know from the IB how this positively effects throttle response. 

Having said that, the cost of that lot is more than everything I have spent so far, so there is a point where you just say it's good enough.  Once a big trip is under my belt I will have a better idea.

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I have just come back (mid May) from a 1700 miles road trip to the Algarve using my son's 2005 3.2S Boxster (13 years old, 95K miles) as my IB is being rebuilt.

The Boxster was in the company of 2x 991 GT3's, 1x 991 Turbo S, 1x 991 CS and 1x 996 C2 and easily kept pace with this bunch to the extent the they were shocked at how quick and capable particularly around the twisty it was - won't say how fast we were going at times!

It's a stonkingly good car, ideal to be used as a daily but can turn holigan if required, It will never match the rawness and driving DNA of the IB, but ts 90%+ and it's comfortable to drive, has modern tech and can carry lots of luggage.

These are real performance bargains.................. 

 

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On 6/5/2018 at 9:42 AM, Richard Bernau said:

- Kumho PS91 tyres - basically copies of MSS's

Glad you are enjoying the Boxster RB, as the price of 996's looks like it's significantly increased the Boxster has to be one of the best the bargain modern Porsches. I did always wonder what it would be like to buy a V8 Cayenne or Cayenne Turbo, strip all of the bulk out of the thing &see how it goes.

Anyway, what is the deal with the Kuhmo's? I'm a bit surprised as I'd have expected you to pick a more 'premium' brand. How have you found them in the wet & dry? Any regrets for not going for a Michelin/Bridgestone/Conti etc? Basically, for everyday driving with some occasional enthusiam thrown in, are they much cop?

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N

11 hours ago, ALEX P said:

Kumho PS91 tyres

I have no experience with the Kumho's, but for the Algarve trip I put a set of Falken Azenis FK510 on the Boxster.

I must say they worked extremely well in the dry, wet and the two hailstone storms we had to drive through.

They got a good write up in Auto Bild, that said all reviews are subjective as based on the individuals preferences.........

http://www.tyrereviews.co.uk/Article/2017-Auto-Bild-Summer-Tyre-Test.htm

 

Edited by Beaky
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That Auto-Bild test is not too flattering, but the tirerack test (google it) vs MSS etc shows its fairly competitive.  So far, the PS91 is exceeding my expectations.  Best description is that its a copy of the Supersport, which I have on 2 other cars and accordingly know well and which is a brilliant tyre.  The Box is noticeably better to drive now on PS91s than on the somewhat old but only 1/3 worn n-spec RE050s that are on my 19s.  Turn in is crisp, ride is fractionally improved, braking is better (ABS triggered later), mid corner speeds higher before breakaway. The ability to lean on the front end on 96/97/87 series cars is staggering compared to IBs.   

I ran cheap Bridgestones on the 3.2 for road trips in the past and never missed the last few % of grip.  I like a fairly stiff sidewall and good turn in and focus more on having the suspension working well to get the most from the tyres rather than having std mushy suspension being flatted by the best tyres.  So for me, having stiffer spring rates, more controlled damping, less body roll and decent amounts of negative camber are more important than the tyres.  Having said that, I really don't think the PS91 is in any way a bad tyre, so far.  In fact, really rather good and a bl00dy bargain.

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As part of Porsche Hatfields 70 year celebrations, I was able to test drive the 718S.

With 350bhp, 0-60 in 4.4, 177 top end, this little gem with PDK and Sports plus is bloody pretty quick around the twist bits.

That said you can feels its weight particularly when pushing hard around corners, if it were 100kg lighter it would feel more nimble, but it doesn't detract from its overall capability.

It doesn't have the noise, smell, rawness or drama of older cars, but its damn good for what it's built.

Would I buy one, No, would my son buy one, yes................

I would imaging that a 987S gen 2 PDK, lightened, chipped and with the right suspension set up would be a hoot

 

 

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On ‎6‎/‎12‎/‎2018 at 11:20 AM, Beaky said:

I would imaging that a 987S gen 2 manual, lightened, chipped and with the right suspension set up would be a hoot

Fixed it for you.

Seriously though, totally agree that the 718S looks jolly fast and 987s are a hoot.  Truthfully, for the type of driving I love in the Alps etc, 250-300hp and nat aspirated throttle response is perfect.  The gen 2 987s seem a good bet with the "good" engine, but they have the unnaturally long 1st and 2nd gears which to me were a deal breaker.  You are right that weight reduction, slight hp and suspension bring the car alive.

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PDK is highly efficient and has its own attractions, but if you really love driving and all the pieces of feedback and interaction with the car, then changing gears yourself will always be preferred.  A perfectly matched heel-n-toe down change is always going to be a more satisfying experience than clicking the left hand paddle. 

The goal isn't (for me at least) going faster, its having more fun.

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I’d have agreed with you 100% just a week ago Richard. Last weekend, I had a test drive in this in a new 911 Targa 4S with pdk. It was hugely impressive and so darn fast. No I’m split 50/50. Love the interaction of the manual gearboxes I own but that New targa was a lot of fun and so easy to go fast. Maybe that was it’s failing, just too easy to go fast. 

Ive been looking to upgrade my 2.7 987 but reading your thread has me thinking about possibly going a different route. I was leaning toward a 981S but wonder if a cheaper Gen 2 987S might be a better buy and throw a little at suspension, exhaust etc. 

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5 minutes ago, Busybee said:

I’d have agreed with you 100% just a week ago Richard. Last weekend, I had a test drive in this in a new 911 Targa 4S with pdk. It was hugely impressive and so darn fast. No I’m split 50/50. Love the interaction of the manual gearboxes I own but that New targa was a lot of fun and so easy to go fast. Maybe that was it’s failing, just too easy to go fast. 

I think this is the crux of the matter. The PDK is so impressive and effortlessly fast. Nothing wrong with this. But if what you crave is working harder and more reward - for actually going a bit slower - then a manual is for you.

I'm in the market for a GT3 and having the same debate about a 991.1 PDK and a 997.2 with manual. The former is much faster and has better roadholding, and easier to drive very fast, but I think I'm going to keep it old school. However will enjoy test driving both :-))))

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PDK is by most measures "better".  Changes gear faster, matches revs perfectly, more economical etc.  Choosing manual must therefore be for subjective reasons which means it won't be for everyone.  I have flappy paddles in my everyday/station car and its still fun, just slightly less than if it was a manual ;) 

Mr Devil - 997 GT3 will IMHO be judged very well in the context of the evolution of GT3s.

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1 minute ago, Richard Bernau said:

Mr Devil - 997 GT3 will IMHO be judged very well in the context of the evolution of GT3s.

Yes this is my expectation too. However on the flip I have the IB for manual and analogue involvement. I don't think that is going to sway me overall to PDK, though.

Not many years left for us lot to enjoy these manual, non-turbo, non-hybrid dinosaurs! Enjoy them whilst you can. Turcan or whatever it is called is the digital future.

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GT3 😋 delish. As an aside from the pdk/manual debate, what do you think of the 996GT3. Some low mileage affordable (in comparison) examples about. 

The 987s or 981s is to replace my daily driver. The 2.7 I have is lovely and pristine but it just doesn’t have the shove when called upon. 

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2 minutes ago, Busybee said:

what do you think of the 996GT3.  

Some say they are the best GT3s.  Depends on your threshold for using them.  Some are happy to thrash a £200k car, but I feel happier thrashing a £20k car, but then as my lovely wife keeps reminding me, I am strictly second tier.

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Never mind 20k, I'm happy thrashing my £450 67hp race car these days... Even more fun especially with a load of ex Touring car racers on track (rubbing is racing). I'll update my thread 😉

Personally I have discounted the 996 - great car - because I won't be using it every weekend on the track. The 996 is arguably the best choice if what you want is a clubsport and you are simply doing trackday seasons. 

Anyway back to Boxsters, I am massively enjoying what you are doing with yours Richard. Second thoughts on the bonkers Turbo build as a result??? 😉

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There’s just too many options in the Porsche world. Maybe a 996GT3 would be a good investment. Currently at around 65k. Potentially a climber in 5-10 years as the price of the latest incarnations keeps steadily rising. 

Yes, back to Boxsters. Gen 2 987s or 981s for me. I love open top motoring so it has to be a Boxster. Caymans are a looker but I’d miss the wind in the hair (while I’ve still got it lol). 981 is a lovely looking car but I’ve heard a bit more portly and not quite as nimble as the 987. Gen 2 987s with upgraded brakes, a sports exhaust (unless comes standard) and upgraded suspension sounds like a lot of fun, right? 

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1 hour ago, reddevil said:

Second thoughts on the bonkers Turbo build as a result??? 😉

If I ever get it back....

1 hour ago, Busybee said:

Gen 2 987s with upgraded brakes, a sports exhaust (unless comes standard) and upgraded suspension sounds like a lot of fun, right? 

Yes.  As I said above, for me a gen 1 made more sense.

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Curve ball time.

Find a 987 3.4 with a bad engine, then rebuild and take it out to 3.8 - when Nick Fulljames was at Autofram I think a 3.8 or 4.0 on the M96 engine was an option.

Now that would be mega!

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It still doesn't make economic sense.  Assuming you can even find one.  The cost for a performance oriented rebuild - like Autofarm did on Josh Sadler's 996 - with displacement, cams, rods, etc - is getting on for £20k.  Even a std Hartech build with 6 new pistons and barrels is about £10k.  Some of the small indies buy the broken cars and do a cheap as possible rebuild with one new p&c and then sell on.  A private buyer can't compete with that.

Honestly, I have spent so many hours thinking this through before buying mine.  Out of the universe of possibles, there are very few that even vaguely stack up on a value for money basis. 

I have spent ~£3k in parts on mine (coilovers, wheels, seats, seat bases, Carnewal GT exhaust, CL pads, deep sump, tyres) plus some labour and even that is money I know I will never likely see again.  And I think I have done it really cheaply by staying away from bran names like Recaro and KW.  Next steps?  Clutch, diff, LW flywheel, IMS would be logically next and perhaps 340mm front brake discs, then maybe think more LW stuff and more hp.  That to me is the logical progression, but the most logical thing would be to stop now and enjoy as is.

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1 hour ago, Richard Bernau said:

It still doesn't make economic sense. 

I was applying man maths to try justify a sleeper, but you are correct, anyway want to sell your's once finished:ninja:

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