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Oil Cooling


Beaky

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33 minutes ago, Phill said:

That is your problem. I would say 9 o'clock at normal motorway speeds is too hot. I think you need to change them back to original.

At motorway speeds temperature is below 9 o'clock.

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Think those rubber lines won't be helping you one bit. The original metal lines form part of the heat radiation system. You're basically blocking part of the heat escape route using rubber lines. Check them when the engine is hot and I bet they'll be cooler to the touch than the front rad. 

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I’ld replace those rubber lines pronto; the hard lines originally fitted presented a fairly large surface area which was surfaced cooled by air flow, this would be negated by flexible lines......unbelievable that someone would do this!!??! ###@@

David

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18 minutes ago, David Gander said:

unbelievable that someone would do this!!??! ###@@

It was probably a decision based on cost...

I have to say that in normal operation oil temperatures are perfectly fine. Yesterday, however, was quite hot and track driving put a thermal stress far beyond what I can achieve when driving fast on a public road!

I have been looking at Elephant Racing finned oil lines. They are made out of brass which is a good thermal conductor. About 5 metres of finned oil lines exposed to airflow (I don't have rocker panels) could be a nice radiator in itself :) Has anyone around here tried them?

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8 hours ago, David Gander said:

I’ld replace those rubber lines pronto; the hard lines originally fitted presented a fairly large surface area which was surfaced cooled by air flow, this would be negated by flexible lines......unbelievable that someone would do this!!??! ###@@

David

Many competition 911's - circuit, safari etc run braided lines to the cooler. If they are sized correctly and the right liner they won't be causing the problems on this car. If they are rubber coolant hoses then the liner could be degrading.

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12 hours ago, David Gander said:

Yes, but most completion cars have extra oil cooling radiators and fans, cooling from the oil lines would be negligible in those circumstances.

 

Exactly. I'm now evaluating whether it's simpler/cheaper to

  • change the stock SC front heat exchanger for a 3.2 style one
  • change the oil lines running from the engine to the stock SC heat exchanger
  • add a second oil heat exchanger to be extra safe and ready for the day when I upgrade the engine
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9 hours ago, WP0ZZZ said:
 

Exactly. I'm now evaluating whether it's simpler/cheaper to

  • change the stock SC front heat exchanger for a 3.2 style one
  • change the oil lines running from the engine to the stock SC heat exchanger
  • add a second oil heat exchanger to be extra safe and ready for the day when I upgrade the engine

Establish what is causing the problem.

measure the temperature of the oil in the tank and cooler.

There could be many reasons why your temperature gauge shows a high reading.

Faulty gauge 

Blocked thermostat

Timing / fuel issues 

Mechanical problems.

If everything is working correctly and in good condition your current setup should be fine.

Did you check the engine cooler and duct supplying air from the fan?

18 hours ago, ras62 said:

Rubber will degrade, you don't want that in the oil system!

Numerous rubber hoses in the factory fitted system. The problem starts when people buy the wrong type of rubber. Lots of poor quality hoses especially the braided types available online. Quality hoses are quite expensive so many jump at the low quality alternatives hoping for the best.

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2 hours ago, Leicestershire said:

Establish what is causing the problem.

Mechanical problems.

If everything is working correctly and in good condition your current setup should be fine.

As mentioned above you need to check that the gauges are correctly recording the actual temperatures -  I had a faulty Alternator that caused my gauges to show read wong - temp reading high,  and oil pressure reading low, but no other signs apart for a very slow crank on start up.   

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  • 4 weeks later...

The Elephant Racing kit will be fitted on the 22nd, will be driving to Honfleur for the weekend on the 25th so will report back on how the kit performed - it probably will not be needed this late in the year!

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  • 3 weeks later...

So fan fitted today, stationary test went well, when the fan kicked in saw a big good drop on the temp gauge.

The system is adjustable so the fans kick in temperature setting can be simply changed on the control unit. 

Real test will be sitting in traffic in the summer, 👍

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  • 4 months later...
On 9/7/2019 at 1:13 PM, WP0ZZZ said:

Thanks for all the comments. Later today, I'll check whether the front radiator gets hot.

Something that I didn't mention and might be relevant is that when I bought the car the oil lines had been replaced with rubber hoses with external metal braiding. Although I removed the rocker panels (which should improve line cooling), I think that the rubber lines might less energy dissipation than the originals...

image.thumb.png.5c0a499a2e5022af87a0f9b1af3c8f13.png

Not sure if it's useful but in normal motorway traffic the oil temp gauge was below 9 o'clock although I guess that in this case all the energy dumping could be handled by the engine mounted cooler alone?

Just un update on the oil rubber hoses on my car. I recently replaced them by Elephant Racing brass finned oil lines.

I was on a track day yesterday with 16 deg air temperature and cooling didn't improve noticeably with respect to the old rubber hoses. The oil temperature gauge was getting close to the red zone after 5 hard laps. That's driving with about 80% of the lap with full throttle. Driving hard on a mountain road temperature stays well in check.

I haven't tested the thermostat but I think it's working properly. Yesterday, after a few hot laps I could measure more than 100 deg with an IR sensor pointing at the front 28-tube brass cooler. 

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It shouldn’t be getting that hot that quick.

so agree, you need to have the thermostat checked, I’d also have the gauge calibrated to see if it’s showing a correct reading, but before hand does your local garage have a spare one you can borrow and test?

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41 minutes ago, Beaky said:

It shouldn’t be getting that hot that quick.

so agree, you need to have the thermostat checked, I’d also have the gauge calibrated to see if it’s showing a correct reading, but before hand does your local garage have a spare one you can borrow and test?

I think I could get the gauge calibration checked pretty easily.

Does anyone know what the realtionship between volts and degrees should be?

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11 hours ago, WP0ZZZ said:

I think I could get the gauge calibration checked pretty easily.

Does anyone know what the realtionship between volts and degrees should be?

Both the gauges and the fed to the gauges should be checked.

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45 minutes ago, Beaky said:

Both the gauges and the fed to the gauges should be checked.

How can I check the signal arriving to the gauge? Is it easy to remove the oil temp sensor and submerge it in boiling water?

I'm planning to make a simple alumnium plate around the front oil cooler in order to force air to go through the cooler and not above or on its sides. Like the one on the Carrera 3.2.

I'm also thinking about making a scoop under the bumper to divert some air uppwards into the cooler.

Image result for carrera 3.2 oil cooler

 

 

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Pelican sells this scoop - no idea how effective it is - https://www.pelicanparts.com/catalog/shopcart/911M/POR_911M_UPrc91_pg7.htm

I have seen people cut out a section of the underside of the bumper to allow more air into the cooler.

And might be worth blowing compressed air backwards through the cooler's fins to clear out any dust and debris that has built up over time.

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2 hours ago, WP0ZZZ said:

How can I check the signal arriving to the gauge? Is it easy to remove the oil temp sensor and submerge it in boiling water?

There must be a way to check the current an idle and normal temp, etc, an Auto Electrician will know how.

As a precautionary measure I added the Elephant racing kit (fan in front of the rad)  Which you can have kick in either by a temp switch or a manual switch.

 

 

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8 hours ago, Type911 said:

What not add a fan?

Not sure a fan will add much extra air at track speeds...

 

8 hours ago, sopor said:

Pelican sells this scoop - no idea how effective it is - https://www.pelicanparts.com/catalog/shopcart/911M/POR_911M_UPrc91_pg7.htm

I have seen people cut out a section of the underside of the bumper to allow more air into the cooler.

And might be worth blowing compressed air backwards through the cooler's fins to clear out any dust and debris that has built up over time.

I've seen those scoops a few times on pelican. The cross section of the intake is not large but maybe it's useful...

Last week, before the trackday, I cleaned the oil cooler. It had petrified debris that had become rock solid, probably due to the 100+ deg temperatures on the cooler surface.

182736846_2020-02-2700_49_35.thumb.jpg.1b35676e566702fa3093ef5ff52bf80f.jpg

1649196746_2020-02-2701_49_58.thumb.jpg.186dd6b0dd739afd432967edfbd56249.jpg 

 

 

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