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2020 Alpine Road Trip


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16 hours ago, Spongebob said:

Stupid question - Does firm numbers include passengers or just drivers / cars at this stage ???

It's largely about how many rooms are required.  Going directly to the hotels, I am getting responses back with prices that are equivalent or up to about £10 less than booking.com frequent user rates.  So it's not night and day cost savings.  The Swiss (predictably) don't seem to get the concept of group discount, but I am persevering.  I am asking for half board where available, so number of people per room is relevant. 

I haven't decided quite how to deal with this block/group booking thing yet.  If nothing else, I am working out how many rooms hotels have and whether they can take a 12-20 person group.  Because, you can't tell from booking.com as hotels only release a couple of rooms at a time to them - hence why it always says only 2 rooms available on booking.com.

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3 hours ago, Ian Comerford said:

Need to use that car Les!  Will you have time for an LM trip in June?

Supposed to be going to CLM but I foolishly managed to get my daughter interested in motorsport (thought it was a good idea at the time) and now she wants to come too so I think it'll be in the daily driver. Haven't used the IB since the Hagerty drive it day thing in April :kickrock:

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On 6/20/2019 at 5:28 PM, Richard Bernau said:

At this point those who have shown interest (or at least posted ;) ) are listed below. 35 possibles.

Please SHOUT if you want to be added or removed

 

I'll try and pop by to say hello one day - so don't include me in offical numbers for rooms etc. In middle of similar trip at mo - will try and post some pics over week.

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@Richard Bernau take me off the list please Richard. I'm still trying to find a friend to share costs and I don't want to skew the numbers.

By the way, I would not want a democracy, I would almost insist on being dictated to on something like this. Much much easier........

Edited by Phill
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Another request for feedback -

The hotels are looking a tad more expensive than I hoped (but they look really nice).  I have one very nice place lined up in Austria which is an older hotel, with a very modern spacious spa & wellness centre and restaurant added on.  Looks spectacular.  Point is that the rooms vary considerably in size and nature - there are only 2 smaller rooms, 2 a bit bigger, some mountain view, some suites etc.  Meaning that the prices vary a lot - from EUR165-270 for the night.  To be fair, that includes afternoon tea, breakfast and a five course dinner and obviously access to the spa centre and towels and robes etc.

Reactions to that price?

Similarly, Switzerland is expensive.  The first night is cheap at CHF65, but involves some sharing as noted previously.  I have moved St Moritz overnight stop to Pontresina just up the road, but even so, its still pricey.  I have a hotel lined up that is CHF133-190 (single vs double rooms, but there are only 4 single rooms, though breakfast is included). 

Our last night in Switzerland is the most expensive at CHF190-265 (different quality of double rooms available, incl breakfast, but dinner is + CHF45).  This is (I think) still value for money as it's a spectacular location on the lake edge with a heated outdoor pool overlooking the lake.  And its Switzerland.

My inclination is to slip in a couple of cheap nights to cushion the blow of the expensive nights, BUT I am asking for feedback in advance.

 

FYI, I will open a second topic soon with all the trip details and use this one for chit chat while keeping the other one "clean" for ease of reference.

FYI2, I am going to decline to group book and fund everyone's deposits.  Once I post the accommodation options it will be down to each to book their own rooms direct with the hotels use a pre-agreed reference so the hotel can group us together.

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Richard,

 I thank you for all your hard work thus far, but I'm going to have to ask you to remove my name from the list please. Cost is an issue, but so is time, I already have a 'big holiday' planned post Tokyo 2020, and although I'd love to take my 911 to the Alps, my favoured region would be the one I know very well in the French ski areas of the 3 valleys/Val D'Isere etc. I already know some of the roads well, I already know some friends down there and I'm keen to drive the D911! 

 I'm sure you will all have a fantastic trip!

Chris.

 

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On 6/20/2019 at 4:35 PM, Richard Bernau said:

Re Roadtrippers - it replicates what I am doing on Basecamp.  And they want £ for more than 5 waypoints.  We have used WhatsApp successfully for comms when we get a committed group.  What advantage am I missing CTO?

CTO reporting for duty!

Sounds like you have this all covered, I guess I was wondering that since we're such an eclectic and international bunch on here, perhaps a more 'visible' plan / route might lead to some....

"Oh, my brother runs a hotel just down the road from..."
"I used to live there, much nicer village up the road with a great hotel called..."
"I have a Gite near that location..."
"you must visit the chippy van halfway along the N567 near...."
"the A345 loop off from the N455 is well worth the extra...."

....type of comments.

*Edit just seen your other thread with all the details - clearly on the ball ;)

Edited by jevvy
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Every road trip I have been on has included quite a variety, from really nice right down to camping and even sleeping in the car - I enjoyed the variety and in my experience its quite refreshing to spend the odd night or two in a nice hotel, even better if its after a night camping in tent which might appeal to some in order to offset some costs. I'm ok with whatever but prefer single rooms.

Thanks for the route details on other thread, isn't it B500 (Bundesstrasse 500) rather than A500?

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I am comfortable with those sort of prices.  As Mondrian says all my euro trip have varied from Le Hermatage (turning up there when hot and sweaty for a hard days drive is interesting!) to Ibis Budget to out of session closed camp sites. That’s what adds to the adventure. Living it up and roughing it. 

Cheers for all this effort RB. Top bombin! 👍

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A good mix does make things all the more interesting from experience , certainly not a 5 star queen ,   Ibis buget with the odd Ibis styles thrown is fine  ;)  ,  Switzerland is never cheap unfortunately , but happy to go with the flow ,    Great job Richard for organising .  Prices ok if thats wasnt clear !

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Thanks guys. Sounds like we are kind of on the same page. 

I will get the hotels details and prices up on the info topic ASAP. Still waiting on a couple on confirmations. 

Edit- also need the maps...

Edited by Richard Bernau
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1 hour ago, Richard Bernau said:

Thanks guys. Sounds like we are kind of on the same page. 

I will get the hotels details and prices up on the info topic ASAP. Still waiting on a couple on confirmations. 

Im just waiting to book the last two days of the trip as annual leave (I can only book 365 days in advance). I will 100 % confirm my attendance on Thursday.

Trip sounds amazing.

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Plus ones fine and no problem at all with other cars. Fraser may yet me there in his Saab for all we know.  Last year was 987, 997, 993, 964, 911.  We have had Gordo’s old BMW a couple of times as well.

I will try to update the numbers later this evening. See where we are at. 

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Updated list below - still looks very healthy.  That is 28 cars including me.  I reckon when push comes to shove we get half that number, but that is still absolutely awesome and probably makes it as big or bigger than the Slovenia trip and even the Classic LM trips (I think).  Honestly, anything from 5 or 6 cars upwards will be mega.  The plan will be for me to let the hotels know that each person will book directly with the hotel (saves them booking.com commission) and some of the rates are a tad cheaper than the non-refundable or std rates I can see elsewhere.  Once we have say 10 confirmed bookings, I will ask them for a further favour - like free parking (if there is a charge) or a free beer each or something.  And just to be clear, there is no discount or kickback in it for me.  You will be able to use the contact info I will post on the other thread and please use the code "Gruppe Bernau" when booking so they can keep track of things.

So, please take another look at calendars and think about whether you are ready to commit - meaning you will actually book and pay the deposits in the next few days.  I want to give the hotels a firmer number before pushing on any discounts etc.  They have all been incredibly nice and cooperative and will look after us really well.  Hence, I don't want to mess them around.

If not possible to commit, then I will take your name off the list.  That doesn't mean you cannot book later and all the details will stay here and the chat will stay here, so you can follow along and book up hotels any time (if they have rooms later and hopefully at the same rates, though not guaranteed).  I just want a firmer view on real numbers now.  No pressure.

I have put prices at the bottom as they currently stand so you have that info.  The hotels all look good with good restaurants and bar and comfortable rooms.  3 have indoor pools and wellness centres with sauna etc, one has a heated outdoor pool and one more has wellness but no pool.  Anyone unfamiliar with Austrian sauna etiquette, may need to talk to Gordon for instructions and/or health warnings!  Half Board is generally 3-4 courses and my experience of Austrian/alpine hotels suggests its normally good value.  At most of them, the parking is not garaged, but we are staying in small alpine villages with no cities, so I think security will be fine, but just letting you know.  I can always "park you in" with the disposable 987 if you are worried.

@Wingnonut +!

@Chris_911

@MarkJ

@Ian Comerford

@Henry

@Busybee

@petesc30

@Spongebob +1

@GoldenLane

@PorscheApostle

@Chris T

@World Citizen

@Drinky

@SP72

@heckschleuderer

@Dr Rock

@Jonny Hart

@Beaky

@Northy

@EJH911

@sopor

@GimmeShelter

@Mondrian +1

@8adgerx

@jevvy

@Graham
@Jon

Hotel prices based on single occupancy:
Day 0 - CHF65 + dinner (based on sharing rooms and hotel takes 20 on that basis)
Day 1 - EUR58 + EUR33 for half board
Day 2 - 5 rooms at EUR108.50 and next 10 at EUR117.50 (half board)
Day 3 - EUR140 half board
Day 4 - CHF133 (4 singles), CHF190 (8 doubles) and overflow nearby sister hotel CHF115 single
Day 5 - min £156 + CHF45 for half board (some variance based on rooms)
Optional Day 6 - EUR94-100 + dinner 

Edited by Richard Bernau
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A comment on the details posted in the other thread - the map and the verbal route for the afternoon of Day 4 don't match. The map shows going through Livignio and coming over the Bernina Pass while the words talk about taking the single track tunnel from Italy to Switzerland and then driving up the lower Engadine valley.

And any chance of higher resolution images please?

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Comments noted.

And note to self EJH911 is to come off the committed list.

3 hours ago, sopor said:

A comment on the details posted in the other thread - the map and the verbal route for the afternoon of Day 4 don't match. The map shows going through Livignio and coming over the Bernina Pass while the words talk about taking the single track tunnel from Italy to Switzerland and then driving up the lower Engadine valley.

And any chance of higher resolution images please?

I think I will have to PM to you..  If you PM your home email, I can get you maps this evening.  However, this is one of the weaknesses of Basecamp - it doesn't produce a nice detailed image unless you zoom in and then you can't see the whole route, so my screenshots are never great.  If you have Basecamp (its free), then I could send you the route files and you can play with them in Basecamp itself.

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9 minutes ago, Richard Bernau said:

However, this is one of the weaknesses of Basecamp - it doesn't produce a nice detailed image unless you zoom in 

Have you tried printing to PDF? If you select high quality PDF settings you might be able to get some good quality PDF's exported that you can upload for people to download and zoom into?

*edit can you move me to the maybe list please.

Edited by jevvy
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1 minute ago, jevvy said:

Have you tried printing to PDF? If you select high quality PDF settings you might be able to get some good quality PDF's exported that you can upload for people to download and zoom into?

*edit can you move me to the maybe list please.

Noted.  For some reason, I thought that I couldn't upload PDFs here?

 

3 hours ago, sopor said:

A comment on the details posted in the other thread - the map and the verbal route for the afternoon of Day 4 don't match. The map shows going through Livignio and coming over the Bernina Pass while the words talk about taking the single track tunnel from Italy to Switzerland and then driving up the lower Engadine valley.

I see that error now.  This is possibly another quirk of Basecamp and how I use it.  You can add a load of waypoints and go from A to B to C etc, but its much, much easier to just put in a start and end and then click and drag the route where you want to go in the middle.  Sometimes this means lots of detailed drags as the routing algo often seems to want to avoid minor roads and will take you on some bizarre u-turns and backtracks for hundreds of kms until you force it to go where you want.  I think (though could just be my mistake) that when I had St Moritz as the end point it routed the right way, but when I moved to Pontresina, it moved the route.  As I was 100% zoomed in to get the exact street position for the end point at the hotel, I didn't notice it re-route.  This is an easy fix, thankfully, but 100% well spotted.

The other thing I should fess up to again, is that I have been copying this from a commercial trip offering I stumbled across.  Of course the original description is vague and basically a marketing, puff piece, so I am having to work it out from the start/end points and a couple of stated highlights per day.  This has been enormously helpful and time saving but not without some guesswork.  I can't discount the possibility I have simply made a mistake and, with that in mind, I have in the past, used Fraser to vet all my routes and crazier ideas for the very reason of avoiding mistakes.  Short story - keep pointing out mistakes please.

:) :) :) 

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