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Northy

Fuel lines - go original or uprated?

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Obviously the Dr's woes has brought this to all our attention again. 

I've been pricing up replacing the engine bay fuel lines for my SC and the costs are pretty high. Easily > £500 for about 4 hoses.  Which got me thinking; I wonder if it's worth just replacing them all with some braided style hoses from Earl's or Aeroquip?  Are these likely to be better and last longer?

What have others done? just pony up and pay the Porsche tax or replace with quality aftermarket.  I am not at all concerned with originality, just want the best hoses for the dosh. 

Searching Pelican - it would appear some guys do it stateside. 

Here is an interesting one for 3.2 owners: http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-911-technical-forum/80621-notorious-carrera-3-2l-rear-fuel-line-leak-revisited-long.html

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1 minute ago, Chris_911 said:

Nothing to add Lewis but I'm watching with interest.

It was news to me about the 3.2 having a common fuel leak problem.  

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how do they justify such ridiculous prices for rubber hoses?

Makes sense to replace any 30yr old rubber hose to be honest. I was quite pleased when I was Intergrale shopping that most of the old rubber hoses in the tight engine bay had been replaced with silica hoses. Not surprising really that old rubber would perish over time with heat degradation.

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I had front to back lines by BSM using genuine items.  The outgoing lines were in great shape after 30 yrs, it was mainly the connectors/joins which were suffering.

Need to check what’s happened with engine bay lines, presumably new aftermarket items have been fitted due to my different setup.

The 3.2 ‘J’ line has always been an issue - worth giving it a good twist to eyeball any cracks or splits.

 

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6 minutes ago, jevvy said:

I'd want crimped fuel lines if I was going aftermarket with them.

Did you see this on your search:

https://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-911-technical-forum/1030675-replacing-engine-fuel-lines-88-911-a.html

Fuel_Line_Kit1558984990.jpg

 

They look nice Jevvy - I've emailed the bloke to see if he does a set for the SC 👍

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Is it not possible to remove the old hoses, get the end fittings replaced and just get the hoses replaced?

I thought that Kroggers did something similar when putting the 3.6 in his red car.

 

Edited by ALEX P

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1 hour ago, Northy said:

They look nice Jevvy - I've emailed the bloke to see if he does a set for the SC 👍

He replied, thus:

------

Probably? I don’t know if they’re any different from the US variants. 

Can you please send me a picture of your fuel accumulator so I can see the lines going to / from it? That should tell me what I need to know to select the right kit for you. 

Alternatively I could just plan on sending you the complete kit which includes all the hoses you might need. The differences are whether you have hard lines in your engine compartment feeding the engine, and whether you have a Fuel Frequency Valve or not. 

Regardless, the kit will replace all the rubber fuel lines in your engine compartment; there are between 6 and 10 lines. Most lead to/from the fuel distributor. It does not include the injector lines. 

The full kit is $550 plus shipping via PayPal. 

Let me know! I don’t keep them in stock and there’s a 1-3 week build time. 

------

I'll take some photos later on and ping it over to him. 

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1 hour ago, ALEX P said:

Is it not possible to remove the old hoses, get the end fittings replaced and just get the hoses replaced?

I thought that Kroggers did something similar when putting the 3.6 in his red car.

 

Not quite. I used the original fittings that would still work on the conversion, but replaced the hoses after having the fittings cleaned and plated. I am using clamps rated for fuel injection systems, and they have been holding up since I did the conversion.

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So, that guy Paul Mason in the states has confirmed that it's $550 + $50 shipping. So that's £480 landed.  I've asked him for some more information and photos. 

Would anyone else be interested in buying a set? we could split postage costs and try and negotiate a better price?

Since there isn't much in it price wise, I'm not really sure what the better option is. Replace with factory lines or go with something like this. 

Thoughts?

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Being a tight, but sensible Northern lad, I just don't see where these prices are coming from.  Any respectable hydraulic hose Company will make you properly crimped pipes up without an issue or alternatively, order fittings from the likes of Torques or Think Automotive and make them up yourself.  It really isn't rocket science and is something absolutely within the abilities of many DIY'ers around these parts.  I sit at the side of lines I have made up in the race car and that is with 3.5 Bar on the return line, after the rails.  I'll be doing the same with the 911 as well, so I'm speaking with a degree of experience here.

No affiliation, but I've always found Torques fittings to be excellent quality and they have a huge range of Metric and AN sizes available.

 

Edited by oliverjamesthomas

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I guess the other option might be that we get a Porsche specialist interested in developing new pipes and gaining from fitting them for us?  I’ve asked before but not had an answer to this assumption:  I assume the new ones from Porsche are ethanol resistant

I am interested in replacing mine

Ian

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I don’t know OJT.  I had a single line made up for my fuel pressure gauges and it was £50.  The fitting was the expensive bit. 

This is what the US chap said:

I make replacement flexible lines if your hard lines need replacing. If they’re not rusty they’re probably fine. 
 
The lines I use are teflon lined and are impervious to all grades and concentrations and of ethanol. They’re a permanent solution. 
 
I do not have photos of the lines installed, but here is the complete kit:
 
16241748-AE89-4918-878B-1D6A6F7413CF.thumb.jpeg.100e5b3ed76ee8d77c41f32f235d2dcf.jpeg
 
I might speak to Earl’s and see if they can do anything. 
 

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Fittings  re plated,  ready for sending I think to Mr injector but cant be sure  or tbh any decent fuel hose /hydraulic place Pertec probably or Monach in Witney  .

There is one fitting least on a 64 engine that some crimping dies wont fit due to awkward access of the tool so check . I have one which is still clipped a  bit disappointing but a decent clip had been put on and the guy was confident it would be fine , I added another to be sure .

 If I was doing again take your fittings to shop to check their crimping tooling will work . Note pic includes old hoses for lengths also one pipe has fittings at diferent orientation to other end so needs conveying to guy doing the crimping .

SAM_2930.thumb.JPG.b9df25e81ee03d36234ba919a9cec066.JPG

 

 

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6 hours ago, Kroggers said:

Not quite. I used the original fittings that would still work on the conversion, but replaced the hoses after having the fittings cleaned and plated. I am using clamps rated for fuel injection systems, and they have been holding up since I did the conversion.

That's what I tried to write but flippin auto-correct changed my replated for replaced. Good to see you on here anyway buddy.

Henry, is it easy to remove the old hoses from the fittings?

Lewis, those US ones look proper blingy! 

Shirish, be honest - have you already added them to your want list :P

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The original crimps are easy enough to remove , you do have to be very careful however not to nick the barbs of the fitting or it could create a path for fuel to leak back as told to me by the guy who did mine . I used a steady hand and a grinder then tin snips , then cut the hose off with a knife not scoring the fitting , did I say dont  nick the fitting 😉    

 New old pipe fitted below .  Downside is the possible downtime getting pipes plated crimped  ,winter job ? oh and you might find it hard to get yeloow crimps 

  

SAM_2950.JPG

Edited by Henry

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It was 3 yrs ago  , but it wasnt much , certainly less than 150 for pipe and to be crimped may be half that  ,  Not sure on plating cost as I get it free , shouldnt be too much though . You dont need to get the fittings plated of course ,under the cut off old hoses mine were nice nick anyway . 

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32 minutes ago, ALEX P said:

Shirish, be honest - have you already added them to your want list :P

I think BSM would have fitted new lines as the standard 3.2 ones wouldn’t fit with my throttle setup.

The ones above look tasty though, if you like that sort of thing ;) 

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I got a bucket of bits and bobs plated for £50 cash a couple of years ago, left it with them for a week to fit on between jobs.

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Home plating kit? Not much money and probably pretty useful on our old cars. Anyone used one? 

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Please take into account the current trend of fitting uprated fuel pumps.

Pushing 33% more pressure and volume through a system needs a bit of thought and planning:

Component compatibility

Pipe diameter / length

Material rating

Fitting rating 

  

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