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Alpine Route Planning - 2019


EJH911

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Hi,

I posted on RB's other thread but thought, as this moves towards possible fruition, I might start a separate thread for this (given it's some way off RB's topic).

In short, after an "interesting," couple of years at work, I now seem to be gardening for the next 5 1/2 weeks and so it seems sensible to go for a bit of a drive (when I'm usually held up by time constraints / leave days preventing such a trip taking place).

Current plan looks like below...but I was wondering if anyone had any comments as to things I was missing out / should do better on this trip?

1045890492_ScreenShot2019-07-09at15_12_19.png.6bc4c7dd747db112b22b6434fc9dea9e.png

Edited by EJH911
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Off to buy a watch...;)?

How many days? 7 and 8 are missing and 11 is counted twice.

You could come back in one day- I did Marseille to home in one hit in the Saab. Long day on the peage but do-able. You don’t have as far to go as I did.:twocents:

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I was thinking more a "Beginners Guide to the Alps," with the Swiss focus being coincidental (watch position sorted by younger, less sensible, me).  11 days in total; v much a working document as the errors suggest!

I could do the return in a 1-er...but I have found a RFC (really cheap) hotel in Beaune which looks okay...and for the sake of my mind and hearing, quite fancy splitting it.  One of the few times in life I'm not under time pressure.

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Yup, a stop at the Porsche museum and a factory tour are well worth the time. Book the tour in advance. I loved it. Also the back road from Stuttgart to Baden Baden is fabulous. N500 I think it’s called. Black Forest heaven 👍

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Slightly unrelated comment.  I love photos like the one above and find I am drawn to them and want to drive them, but....

The passes full of hairpins are actually the least fun to drive.  The more flowing and open roads are better.  Traffic free is even more betterer.  Unless you are on a mission and using first gear and trying to generate a bit of oversteer, the really tight corners are just a bit of an interruption to the flow/rhythm/vibe of the drive.  And also, unless you are on a mission, its too easy to get stuck behind traffic.  And its the riskiest for meeting cyclists with their heads down and sometimes on the wrong side of the road.   All IMHO.

On the route, if you have to spend a day on the autoroutes, then I would go as far as possible and do it in one - its one wasted day rather than 2.  I have done Switzerland/French Alps back to the UK in one many times.  You just start early and crack on.  Also, on your day 6 and 9 in the French Alps, there are a load more French passes in the immediate area you are missing (I think just at a glance).  Like, out of Briancon, you really want to do the Col d'Izoard with photo stop by the monument.  Its best straight after breakfast :) 

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53 minutes ago, Richard Bernau said:

On the route, if you have to spend a day on the autoroutes, then I would go as far as possible and do it in one - its one wasted day rather than 2.  I have done Switzerland/French Alps back to the UK in one many times.  You just start early and crack on.  Also, on your day 6 and 9 in the French Alps, there are a load more French passes in the immediate area you are missing (I think just at a glance).  Like, out of Briancon, you really want to do the Col d'Izoard with photo stop by the monument.  Its best straight after breakfast :) 

I shall have a look at the French Alp section again; Col d"Izoard was in an earlier draft...but fell out when I split Val D'Isere - Eze into 2 days.  Thinking cap back on.

Still undecided about the schlep from Eze home.  I have done Alps to London in a day and that's fine; not ideal but fine.  800+ miles is rather further than I would like in a day...but I appreciate "just get it done," mentality.  Time to look out the titanium-cored earplugs...

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1 hour ago, Richard Bernau said:

The passes full of hairpins are actually the least fun to drive.  The more flowing and open roads are better. 

+1, those roads look nice & views are nice but not much fun to drive, besides there is always the risk of getting stuck behind a train of cars and not enough road to overtake them all in one go. Fast flowing curvy roads are infinitely more fun.

 

1 hour ago, Richard Bernau said:

On the route, if you have to spend a day on the autoroutes, then I would go as far as possible and do it in one - its one wasted day rather than 2.  I have done Switzerland/French Alps back to the UK in one many times.

-1, I have done plenty of crazy long drives when i was younger but as I have gotten older it has become a bit more challenging. If the idea is to enjoy the drive then for me 800 miles in a day is not fun and by the sound of it you are not on a time budget so no need. If you have too, make sure you get a good night's sleep beforehand and maybe a power nap after lunch to avoid drowsy driving.

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Just now, Mondrian said:

-1, I have done plenty of crazy long drives when i was younger but as I have gotten older it has become a bit more challenging. If the idea is to enjoy the drive then for me 800 miles in a day is not fun and by the sound of it you are not on a time budget so no need. If you have too, make sure you get a good night's sleep beforehand and maybe a power nap after lunch to avoid drowsy driving.

This is the thought process.  For the sake of an extra day (which I have) and a sleep-factory hotel on the way back, I think it might be an easier 2 days than 1. I know none of these cars are quiet...but I am the moron with a cabrio and a H&S exhaust...

<<gets back to Google and spreadsheet>>

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This morning's revisions (some more added to days 6 & 7...although day 7 still a bit quiet as may have a raging thirst and desire to collapse with a book by then):

 

Screen Shot 2019-07-10 at 13.02.40.png

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Looks ok to me.  A couple of hundred miles in a day when on the twisties is a nice target.  It means a couple of hours plus stops morning and afternoon, so very doable.  Gives freedom to stop at the top of all the passes and take photos, look at the view, get an espresso etc.  And you have time for a sensible lunch break, while still having swim/beer-o-clock afternoon time.

To really critique your route, requires plotting the whole thing and then Google Earth or satellite pic maps and working thru the details, looking at alt routes/passes etc, so its the work of hours, not mins.  Then you may start changing overnight stops and it gets complicated.  Accordingly, I am going to politely leave that pleasure to you!  But it likes fine at a glance.

One top tip - any weekend driving days will attract a lot more traffic, particularly of the 2 wheeled variety.  Just an FYI, not much you can do about it.  911s generally do pretty well on overtaking with 2nd being particularly useful and decent tq and throttle response, but unless you have a certain amount of aggression, you can become hostage to the tourists.

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49 minutes ago, Richard Bernau said:

Looks ok to me.

All the feedback I could ask for!  I have been playing with Google Earth and the spreadsheet for much of the day...and it's the easiest way to lose hours of time that I have found recently!

Still need to work out the days to go which may be as early as next week or may be a few weeks hence.  Also looking at Tour de France dates as that looks to kibosh some dates in late July.

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11 hours ago, Richard Bernau said:

Slightly unrelated comment.  I love photos like the one above and find I am drawn to them and want to drive them, but....

The passes full of hairpins are actually the least fun to drive.  The more flowing and open roads are better.  Traffic free is even more betterer.  Unless you are on a mission and using first gear and trying to generate a bit of oversteer, the really tight corners are just a bit of an interruption to the flow/rhythm/vibe of the drive.  And also, unless you are on a mission, its too easy to get stuck behind traffic.  And its the riskiest for meeting cyclists with their heads down and sometimes on the wrong side of the road.   All IMHO.

On the route, if you have to spend a day on the autoroutes, then I would go as far as possible and do it in one - its one wasted day rather than 2.  I have done Switzerland/French Alps back to the UK in one many times.  You just start early and crack on.  Also, on your day 6 and 9 in the French Alps, there are a load more French passes in the immediate area you are missing (I think just at a glance).  Like, out of Briancon, you really want to do the Col d'Izoard with photo stop by the monument.  Its best straight after breakfast :) 

I too prefer flowing roads rather than countless hairpins. The top of the Maloja is definitely a series of hairpins but the view of what's below (or above) you is quite something. The lower sections are more flowing. And having cycled up and down it my younger days I never get tired of driving it. As it's not a major north-south thoroughfare traffic isn't that big an issue.

And speaking of countless hairpins... that would be the Stelvio then!

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Made it to Baden-Baden.  Car hasn't broken yet <<crosses fingers>>

Slightly optimistic on the miles as 520 done today...and a re-route tomorrow as trying to get to Zurich to see a friend for lunch after the N500.

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12 hours ago, Dr Rock said:

 

47256B20-76A4-474A-A961-4ADE7AE4CEEA.jpeg

All in good time (when I get around to it).  Photos as taken are going on Instagram (ejhalliday) should anyone care to see what's happening sooner.

Was late into Baden-Baden yesterday as went the long way (Belgium and Lux) and lost an hour on the phone to Expedia who decided to cancel 2 of my bookings...and couldn't quite say why.  This route had an added bonus of some derestricted autobahn which I hadn't counted on.

Route was changed today as went to Zurich for a very pleasant lunch...but did have a good poke around Lichtenstein (stranger than I thought it could be) before heading to Davos (mostly closed...but tired and in a comfy hotel that had a killer deal)

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58 minutes ago, EJH911 said:

...but did have a good poke around Lichtenstein (stranger than I thought it could be) 

Odd innit? Cross over the river and back again. It’s almost a one horse town...

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7 hours ago, Dr Rock said:

It’s almost a one horse town...

...in the Swiss countryside...from the 1970s...with a load of modern-ish accountants' offices.  V odd..but glad I went for a look.

Drove up the hill to have a look as well.  Ended up spending ~90 mins there...which is about 75 more than I expected.

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LONG day today with a couple of diversions.  Have photos and notes so a full update will follow when I'm not shattered and have been in the sun for 11 hours.

Some updates to whet the appetite (if there is one):

Day 3.jpeg

Stelvio 1.jpeg

Stelvio 2.jpeg

Stop.jpeg

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12 minutes ago, Dr Rock said:

8 hours to do 180 miles....:steering:

I did try; I was overtaking bikes on the Stelvio's East side (well, when I came back up it again).

My shoulders took an absolute hammering...but pass of the day for me was Julier.  Wide open, the hairpins are huge and with sightlines of 2-3 layers down, you can use all the road.  It's like a Highland road that went through the photocopier at 300%.

Didn't fill up today but fuel usage on Umbrail and Stelvio was "moderately horrifying."  (Looked for fuel in Livigno but no 98 to be found - VPower 100 is first stop tomorrow morning - conveniently at the start of the first pass).

Edited by EJH911
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Looks wonderful - colour me jealous!

There is a little lesson to be learned here for anyone planning a trip - it can take a while to cover miles once in the Alps and on the tight and twisties.  Something like 40mph avg speed is not unrealistic.

The amount of castor in the 3.2 geo does make the steering really weight up once off the straight ahead, but just think of the shoulder muscles you are building.

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2 minutes ago, Richard Bernau said:

just think of the shoulder muscles you are building

Shoulder and left leg day at the gym! You'll make a great one legged shot putter someday ;)

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