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Mondrian

Speeding fines in Europe?

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It’s radar and cameras during daylight, just the cameras during the hours of darkness. 

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Are radar detectors a worthwhile investment if speed enforcement/entrapment is becoming more prevalent? If so, what’s the best or most reliable? 

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You are not allowed to use them to evade speed traps. If caught using one you can be fined, so should disable the function

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Posted (edited)

According to this article

 

" .... SPEED CAMERA WARNING DEVICES  These have been banned in France since 2011. Drivers using radar detectors (speed camera detectors) are liable for a fine of 1500 Euros and 6 points off their licence. This applies to specific radar warning devices, such as the Coyote, which must have their software updated to remain legal.
    With regard to TomToms and other GPS systems, which have speed camera locations programmed in to their software, the situation is confusing. These are not officially "radar detectors", but manufacturers are obliged to make new software available, and most have done so. Tomtoms and other GPS systems are technically in breach of the law if they still have radars listed in their Points of Interest software; and even if it is not clear how roadside police can stop and check for offending software, rather than hardware, drivers are warned to err on the side of precaution and download the latest map software for France.  This is advisable anyway, since older software is not up to date with regard to new routes, new speed restrictions, and other changes.
   For both existing radar warning devices and GPS devices, current radar information is being replaced with warnings to announce "danger zones", many of which will be areas with speed cameras.... "

https://about-france.com/highway-code.htm

 

There is also some confusion on speed limits and fines as it seems that each prefecture has the ability to increase fines/limits.

https://www.connexionfrance.com/French-news/One-department-gets-tough-on-speeding-drivers

 

Speed limit tolerance seems to be set at 5%

https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/cars/article-7331549/Speed-camera-tolerances-France-HALF-Britain.html

Edited by Mondrian

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Police make you drive over your camera detector if they catch you. 

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8 hours ago, Flat 6 said:

I've just paid a French speeding fine from a roadside camera that pinged me back in Feb on the way back from a days skiing.

I was in my sisters car and she lives in the Alps so the paperwork came to her first. With my knowledge,  she passed my details onto the enforcement team. Eventually I received the email. It was initially a fine of €43 for being 3kph over the new 80kph route national limit. But because of the time it took to send it to me in the UK, the pay early option had expired so it was now €68.

As a matter of principle, I appealed the extra cost. They accepted that and I paid €43.

Honestly my experience of driving in France in UK reg family estates, 911s and various French registered borrowed or hired cars is that the police are no better or worse than at home. I have had multiple stern warnings from bike cops on the way to and from Le Mans but never a fine.

I did narrowly miss a speeding sting operation on the big dual carriageway going into Cherbourg one year and they were clearly targeting returning Brits. Mind you, I'm pretty sure if 150,000 frenchmen decided to visit the Silverstone 12hr every year and drove the way we do between the Channel and the track the UK police would have a field day.

Bonne Route!

 

This ^^^.  I am constantly surprised at how I can drive around Europe like a loon and don't end up with a boatload of fines.  Those that know me, know that I find it hard to resist attacking a tasty looking piece of road and that means speed is entirely determined by the road and whatever the limit is goes out the window.  I am very respectful of villages and the like and find lots of good vibes and thumbs up is the norm (unlike in the UK where its flashed lights and disapproving looks).  There is no way speeding fines and LE attitude are worse than the UK.  Even Switzerland, that is a virtual police state, I have found to be fine.  The only thing you tend to get is the slight hint of corruption - like our Spanish cops insisting our handsfree walkies equated to using a mobile non-handsfree while driving and demanding a EUR100 fine from each.  Now in the UK, you might have argued the point and said first, you are wrong and second we weren't using them, but you don't have the opportunity in a foreign country, so you just pay the fine.  I have had something similar at Le Mans many years ago.  But that is twice in 20 years and I make 2+ trips every year.

My German experience is that I seem to get a camera fine somewhere on most trips - usually a temp 80kmh camera in road works and I misjudge it slightly and get a flash for say 3 kmh over or thereabouts.  The ticket is about EUR15, so who cares.  On this basis alone, I would recommend Germany as a route to the Alps (plus black forest, plus autobahns, plus German beer, plus dirndls :) ).  I run either my Garmin or Waze with camera alerts on and can't really see how you get caught doing this.  But a radar detector will get spotted and crushed, so that is out for me.  the databases are very good meaning a detector 99% of the time is not needed. 

As Felix said, if you do the crime, you do the time. Just take it on the chin, have fun and avoid absolute stupidity.

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Anyone else have NWA blasting in their heads? 

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23 minutes ago, Richard Bernau said:

This ^^^.  I am constantly surprised at how I can drive around Europe like a loon and don't end up with a boatload of fines.  Those that know me, know that I find it hard to resist attacking a tasty looking piece of road and that means speed is entirely determined by the road and whatever the limit is goes out the window.  I am very respectful of villages and the like and find lots of good vibes and thumbs up is the norm (unlike in the UK where its flashed lights and disapproving looks).  There is no way speeding fines and LE attitude are worse than the UK.  Even Switzerland, that is a virtual police state, I have found to be fine.  The only thing you tend to get is the slight hint of corruption - like our Spanish cops insisting our handsfree walkies equated to using a mobile non-handsfree while driving and demanding a EUR100 fine from each.  Now in the UK, you might have argued the point and said first, you are wrong and second we weren't using them, but you don't have the opportunity in a foreign country, so you just pay the fine.  I have had something similar at Le Mans many years ago.  But that is twice in 20 years and I make 2+ trips every year.

My German experience is that I seem to get a camera fine somewhere on most trips - usually a temp 80kmh camera in road works and I misjudge it slightly and get a flash for say 3 kmh over or thereabouts.  The ticket is about EUR15, so who cares.  On this basis alone, I would recommend Germany as a route to the Alps (plus black forest, plus autobahns, plus German beer, plus dirndls :) ).  I run either my Garmin or Waze with camera alerts on and can't really see how you get caught doing this.  But a radar detector will get spotted and crushed, so that is out for me.  the databases are very good meaning a detector 99% of the time is not needed. 

As Felix said, if you do the crime, you do the time. Just take it on the chin, have fun and avoid absolute stupidity.

I'd agree on going through Germany to get the Alps, I do this route from Calais regularly, best bit about it is no French tolls and minimal French road time 👍

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7 minutes ago, Richard Bernau said:

...and dirndls.

RB I was worried you we're having some sort of dyslexic seizure while typing that 🤪

Had to Google it and yes another very good reason for going the German way......

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3 hours ago, Richard Bernau said:

...and dirndls.

What no Schweinshaxe or wurst?

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best ticket avoidance I ever had was in France whilst driving on an amazing forested road, going at a decent lick (as you do!) when I started getting flashed by French truck drivers. At first I thought they were admiring the classic 911 flicking through the twisties then twigged after a couple did it.  Dropped the speed right down to below the limit and just around the bend was a full on Gendarme road block with camera wielding cops. Can still remember the look of abject disgust on a sergeants face as he realised his prey had alluded him, he gave me the filthiest of looks. I tried to resist the triumphant smile as I pootled through his road block :D So French truckers hate their road cops more than an Englishman in a German sports car :lol:

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1 hour ago, Mondrian said:

What no Schweinshaxe or wurst?

I fluctuate on my opinion of German cuisine.  Can be great when appropriate, but generally too heavy for me.  I am light weight in all respects :) 

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On 16/06/2020 at 09:00, Richard Bernau said:

I run either my Garmin or Waze with camera alerts on and can't really see how you get caught doing this.

I note that my Waze no longer has option for warning about Police or mobile cameras, though fixed camera locations still pop up.

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On 16/06/2020 at 09:00, Busybee said:

Anyone else have NWA blasting in their heads? 

KRS-One actually....

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10 hours ago, Jonny Hart said:

KRS-One actually....

Was kinda thinking "**** the police"

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Rather than its too late! "sound of da police" lol 

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On 16/06/2020 at 10:41, MarkJ said:

best ticket avoidance I ever had was in France whilst driving on an amazing forested road, going at a decent lick (as you do!) when I started getting flashed by French truck drivers. At first I thought they were admiring the classic 911 flicking through the twisties then twigged after a couple did it.  Dropped the speed right down to below the limit and just around the bend was a full on Gendarme road block with camera wielding cops. Can still remember the look of abject disgust on a sergeants face as he realised his prey had alluded him, he gave me the filthiest of looks. I tried to resist the triumphant smile as I pootled through his road block :D So French truckers hate their road cops more than an Englishman in a German sports car :lol:

I’ve never come across any French Police on country roads other than immediately around Le Mans. Worrying as we always purposely stay off autoroutes and enjoy the “freedom” of the D roads between the village exit and entry signs. Ironic as excess speed on a country road vs the same on an autoroute is considerably more dangerous. Ashamed to say that if I had ever been caught  in one of your road blocks Mark I’d probably still be locked up!

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Webfleet Solutions takes the legality of its services extremely seriously. Therefore, our network of legal advisors regularly informs us of the applicable legislation relating to speed camera services in a select number of territories. As a result, we were informed that, as of 28 April 2020, the German law regarding speed camera warnings has changed. This email serves to inform you about the change and the consequences thereof.

According to the most recent changes to the German Road Traffic Regulation (Straßenverkehrsordnung) anyone who drives a vehicle may not operate or carry a speed camera warning device nor use the speed camera warning functions inside navigation systems and smartphone apps. A fine of 75 euros and addition of 1 point to the German Driving Aptitude Register may be imposed on a driver violating the above-mentioned provision. Whilst the legislation does not make it illegal to deliver a speed camera service and only targets final users of such a service, this change nonetheless is clearly material to our service in Germany.

How does this new regulation affect you?
In accordance with this regulation, we recommend that you disable safety camera warnings from your PRO Driver Terminals before and during your journeys within Germany. Webfleet Solutions will stop including speed camera information from the LIVE Services and from the map data (only applicable for speed cameras located in Germany). In the next map update we will remove the speed camera information from your device. We will inform you accordingly when the update will take place. Subsequently, you will also need to update the map in order to ensure that all speed camera locations in Germany are completely removed.

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8 minutes ago, mean in green said:

Webfleet Solutions takes the legality of its services extremely seriously. Therefore, our network of legal advisors regularly informs us of the applicable legislation relating to speed camera services in a select number of territories. As a result, we were informed that, as of 28 April 2020, the German law regarding speed camera warnings has changed. This email serves to inform you about the change and the consequences thereof.

According to the most recent changes to the German Road Traffic Regulation (Straßenverkehrsordnung) anyone who drives a vehicle may not operate or carry a speed camera warning device nor use the speed camera warning functions inside navigation systems and smartphone apps. A fine of 75 euros and addition of 1 point to the German Driving Aptitude Register may be imposed on a driver violating the above-mentioned provision. Whilst the legislation does not make it illegal to deliver a speed camera service and only targets final users of such a service, this change nonetheless is clearly material to our service in Germany.

How does this new regulation affect you?
In accordance with this regulation, we recommend that you disable safety camera warnings from your PRO Driver Terminals before and during your journeys within Germany. Webfleet Solutions will stop including speed camera information from the LIVE Services and from the map data (only applicable for speed cameras located in Germany). In the next map update we will remove the speed camera information from your device. We will inform you accordingly when the update will take place. Subsequently, you will also need to update the map in order to ensure that all speed camera locations in Germany are completely removed.

unrestricted Autobahn is the answer, I enjoyed a long +130mph blast with a 993 in my 930

German drivers are great, they just leave the outside lane for those drivers that want to press on a bit

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39 minutes ago, Wingnonut said:

I’ve never come across any French Police on country roads other than immediately around Le Mans. Worrying as we always purposely stay off autoroutes and enjoy the “freedom” of the D roads between the village exit and entry signs. Ironic as excess speed on a country road vs the same on an autoroute is considerably more dangerous. Ashamed to say that if I had ever been caught  in one of your road blocks Mark I’d probably still be locked up!

Other than the regular Le Mans revenue catchers, I’ve never really come across them again despite driving around France nearly every year, except once more in south Dordogne with some far friendlier lady cops 😊. I still offer silent thanks to the French truckers who warned me as that grizzled gendarme looked a right b*stard and had at least 6 other cops with him. I could read on his face that he couldn’t understand why a car like that was going as slow as that on a great country road 😁  - I still expected him to flag me down out of spite. 

Besides, they merely rely on countless cameras to fine us now 🙄 It’s cost them in the long run as I now head east from Calais and head south via Belgium, Luxembourg and Germany rather than paying endless tolls and worrying about being a few kmh over the limit. ☹️

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On 16/06/2020 at 08:04, Busybee said:

If so, what’s the best or most reliable?

Valentine V1.  Seriously illegal abroad, so obviously I've never used one ...

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It won't help you for the French avarage speed cameras, which look a bit like the nearer device in the photo below - kind of a 'hood' on a post.  (We've seen them further south in France, where you get two of them, a distance apart - which seems to vary from hundreds of metres to maybe a kilometre or so.)

image.jpeg.8480800408fc71e5150fbf6243f84b27.jpeg

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Shouldn't the databases pick these up as "Safety Areas" or whatever they call them?  I thought that was what my Garmin did.  And Waze did, or used to do.

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