Ian Comerford Posted August 23, 2021 Share Posted August 23, 2021 I thought this was quite useful. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hagarep Posted August 25, 2021 Share Posted August 25, 2021 Well it made me order a full test kit from ebay, along with a Technical Specifications booklet. My car is old so it's worth checking and i do get hot start issues. Looks like it will be fun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sopor Posted August 25, 2021 Share Posted August 25, 2021 Do you have a link to what you ordered? Am trying to sort out an American spec SC engine that has a WUR unlike any other I’ve seen and a few other questionable “mods”. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mean in green Posted August 25, 2021 Share Posted August 25, 2021 I was also interested, as when I'd previously looked it seemed that the commonly available kits had gauges with not quite the ideal range reading. The guy in the clip also makes reference to this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hagarep Posted August 25, 2021 Share Posted August 25, 2021 https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/265214345409 cheap but looks like the same kit in the video. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian Comerford Posted August 25, 2021 Author Share Posted August 25, 2021 4 hours ago, sopor said: Do you have a link to what you ordered? Am trying to sort out an American spec SC engine that has a WUR unlike any other I’ve seen and a few other questionable “mods”. Have you spoken to Steve at KMI regarding your WUR? Pretty sure he will be able to help Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sopor Posted August 26, 2021 Share Posted August 26, 2021 Cheers Ian, might well be contacting him soon enough. at the moment trying to understand what’s been done. Thermotime switch looks to have been disconnected and WUR gets power all the time. Car stalls very easily when cold - probable because WUR is receiving power too early in the warmup cycle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian Comerford Posted August 26, 2021 Author Share Posted August 26, 2021 2 hours ago, sopor said: Cheers Ian, might well be contacting him soon enough. at the moment trying to understand what’s been done. Thermotime switch looks to have been disconnected and WUR gets power all the time. Car stalls very easily when cold - probable because WUR is receiving power too early in the warmup cycle. From recollection it was £200 for a fully refurbished and recalibrated WUR and it fixed my poor running problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lesworth Posted August 26, 2021 Share Posted August 26, 2021 4 hours ago, sopor said: Cheers Ian, might well be contacting him soon enough. at the moment trying to understand what’s been done. Thermotime switch looks to have been disconnected and WUR gets power all the time. Car stalls very easily when cold - probable because WUR is receiving power too early in the warmup cycle. The WUR should have power all the time. From the moment you start it gets power to heat the bi-metallic strip which increases control pressure and holds it there for warm running. Do you mean the cold start injector? That should only get power under the right conditions, controlled by the thermo time switch (i.e. power is only applied when the TT switch says its cold and power should be cut after a set number of seconds after starting). 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian Comerford Posted August 26, 2021 Author Share Posted August 26, 2021 I’ve just had time to watch the film properly and think it’s really good. It gives some simple explantations of useful tests and is well worth referring to when issues appear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sopor Posted August 26, 2021 Share Posted August 26, 2021 1 hour ago, Lesworth said: The WUR should have power all the time. From the moment you start it gets power to heat the bi-metallic strip which increases control pressure and holds it there for warm running. Do you mean the cold start injector? That should only get power under the right conditions, controlled by the thermo time switch (i.e. power is only applied when the TT switch says its cold and power should be cut after a set number of seconds after starting). Ah, good to know. Last time I played with K Jet was on a 77 VW Scirocoo! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian Comerford Posted August 30, 2021 Author Share Posted August 30, 2021 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lesworth Posted September 1, 2021 Share Posted September 1, 2021 Just watched this - very useful but hard to imagine how some of that could be done with the engine in place, even if it was lowered slightly, even with my small ladies hands. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hagarep Posted October 9, 2021 Share Posted October 9, 2021 So I followed the original diagnostic video and bought a pressure test kit. My fuel consumption was terrible and my plugs black! Then I killed another Varley red top battery and replaced it with a golf buggy AGM of similar size an out put. Now with 12v, I checked my fuel pressures: control 0.4 bar and system 4.0. I should have had 1.0-1.4 control and 4.6-5.2 system. I rebuilt the WUR and found the pin dislodged and replaced the spring for the system pressure. My WUR was already adjustable in anticipation of this. Now it doesn't run at all, I am a week away from Goodwood Members meeting, which will be it's last outing this year and getting desperate. Tomorrow I will back out everything I have done and try going step by step, but I still don't understand as apart from the idle mixture being out, it should have improved things? Jason Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strictly Posted October 10, 2021 Share Posted October 10, 2021 You should set your system first, 4.0 is too low....set that then then the control pressure...0.4 would have been richer than bill gates. So after re-setting your system and Going to 1.0 to 1.4 you have leaned it out, so i would think you would need to adjust you CO screw to bring the balance back....but i would not do that right now. Try some easy start, just to richen it back up to where it was, get it running and then adjust your CO screw. There is also a "base" setting for the CO you can follow, but I have only really ever hand success on a gas analyser PS. for Control...dont forget you need to triagulate, you need to set the control pressure at a specific temperature at a specific vacuum....all "cold" of course (ignition off). Post a picture of your control pressure GRAPH and we can see more Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hagarep Posted October 11, 2021 Share Posted October 11, 2021 I have the spec book for my car and did set the pressure according to the temp. I also have performed the base CO setting, where you lean it out, pressurize the system, then remove an injector pipe and turn the CO screw clockwise until the metering head just starts to let fuel through, then back off half a turn. It still won't run. I intend to put everything back to where it was and try to get it running. Then on my gas analyser, i will make incremental changes and see what happens to the CO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flatsix777 Posted October 11, 2021 Share Posted October 11, 2021 Have you confirmed that your system and control pressures are now in spec having rebuilt the WUR and done the other work? I couldn’t see this in the above posts but might have missed it. If not then I’d sort this first, starting with system pressure. David Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strictly Posted October 11, 2021 Share Posted October 11, 2021 14 hours ago, hagarep said: I have the spec book for my car and did set the pressure according to the temp. I also have performed the base CO setting, where you lean it out, pressurize the system, then remove an injector pipe and turn the CO screw clockwise until the metering head just starts to let fuel through, then back off half a turn. It still won't run. I intend to put everything back to where it was and try to get it running. Then on my gas analyser, i will make incremental changes and see what happens to the CO. This is where i was coming from....whats your WUR part number? I'll have a look, from memory I think the graphs in the factory porsche manuals, have with vaccum, but the Bentley manuals did not....that said if you have a C3....then maybe the vacuum is not even relevant. In any case this was where i was coming from. As we can see the vacuum does not effect the warm pressure....but i cant remember if it effected the cold or not...if relevant you would have to connect and see.... on the running/not running go back to basics, check you have spark, if so pump some easy start into it till it runs, you may have simply knocked the CDI connection without realising it or something simple like that. I would A) Make sure i had spark B) with the ignition and assuming you have a fuel pump relay, then push up on the air flow plate and see if the injectors spray... If you have both....then at worst case give the injectors a quick spray of fuel then spin the engine. On the TTS sensor on the left cam cover there is a solid yellow wire...this is also wired to your starter solenoid, so you can run a quick piggy back of the back of this wire to turn the engine yourself in the engine bay. . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strictly Posted October 11, 2021 Share Posted October 11, 2021 (edited) On 25/08/2021 at 11:12, hagarep said: Well it made me order a full test kit from ebay, along with a Technical Specifications booklet. My car is old so it's worth checking and i do get hot start issues. Looks like it will be fun. P.S my last sc with a hot start issue turned out to be a faulty fuel distributor...it showed up on the system pressure, but only in that it would not hold the "rest pressure"....a new accumulator, and fuel check valves did not cure it, a rebuilt fuel distributor did. Edited October 11, 2021 by Strictly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hagarep Posted October 12, 2021 Share Posted October 12, 2021 This is the graph in the C3 Technical Specifications booklet but it’s significantly different to the one you showed, which is odd because I have an 033 WUR. I set my WUR to 1.2 bar at 16deg C Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Northy Posted October 12, 2021 Share Posted October 12, 2021 Are you getting any firing at all or nothing? Does it smell of fuel? Definitely got fuel when you lift the metering flap? You can disconnect the cut-off solenoid at the back of the throttle body to allow the pump to run. As strictly says, check it’s still sparking too. You’ve probably checked all this stuff but it might be worth just confirming so we can stop saying obvious things 🙂 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hagarep Posted October 13, 2021 Share Posted October 13, 2021 Hi Northy C3's don't have the cut off solenoid. On top of everything else, I went to return the system pressure back to how I found it and broke the plug. that holds the spring and valve in, on Monday night. it's M10 x 1.0 metric fine, but i managed to get something and turn it on my little lathe to make a suitable replacement yesterday. However, I then made some progress. First I checked for spark - no problem there. Next i intended to put the control pressure back to where I found it at 0.4 bar. Set it up for test and noticed the fuel was flowing through the metering head to the injectors. Immediately wound down the CO screw until it stopped. Then I decided to try setting the the pressure using the graph Strictly shared, which covers the 033 WUR. I went for 1.7 bar. At first, hydraulic lock from fuel, followed by a huge spray of it out the exhaust. Got the fire extinguisher close to hand, waited for the fuel to evaporate and tried again. After a few goes, it coughed in to life and with the hand throttle, settled to a lumpy tick over at 2000rpm and 19% CO. managed to get it down to 900 rpm and 3.5% CO before the the carbon monoxide sensor triggered the house alarm and pee'd off my wife and neighbours. Conclusion? Either the graph in the Porsche service booklet is wrong or my 033 WUR is not original/correct for my engine? It would be nice to hear from other C3 owners and learn what WUR is fitted to their cars. At least I now have time to tune it, clean it and get to Goodwood at the weekend. Thanks everyone, for the advice. I was close to giving up for this year. Jason 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lesworth Posted October 13, 2021 Share Posted October 13, 2021 If you can get the WUR part number from PET, I think you can cross reference that with the Bosch number somewhere on the interweb. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strictly Posted October 13, 2021 Share Posted October 13, 2021 (edited) I've got another 76 graph, but it's from the TSB you probably all ready have it but I will post it just to have it up for reference. Funny enough on flicking through other graphs...ive seen the warm control pressure should always change with vaccum, so immediately that casts doubt on the cold graph... I'll post what I have for a 76, can always start with an average Incidently I have always wondered what to do if say the car originally had a 033 and say you fit a 045...readjust to 033 or stay as 045 Guy from the C3 register may know which should be fitted... And also what FD should match. Ill post more later including Guys ib forum contact details Luke Edited October 13, 2021 by Strictly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hagarep Posted October 14, 2021 Share Posted October 14, 2021 Thanks and don't worry. i have sent an email to Guy today. I checked it again last night. Now 1.6 bar at 15 deg and 4.6 system pressure, which i will tweak when i get some more washers. Ran last night at 1.5% CO at 900 rpm. just need to check ignition now as dwell was too low and timing slightly off. 0.35mm gap gives under 58% dwell. should be 63% +/- 3% Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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