Help - I have become a collector!

[Richard Bernau]

This isn't what you think it is.  I haven't bought a load of cars.  No, its something different.  Stay with me...

I have realised in the course of the last year I haven't taken my 'special' car outside of the city where I live other than on one occasion.  That means just one trip when I have got near the redline in anything past 1st gear.  Just one time I have pushed through a sequence of curves.  Just one time I have actually driven just for the sake of driving.  And just one time I can honestly claim to have done something close to 'the thrill of driving'.  Its quite an admission.

So, help - I have become a collector.  How can I hand on heart call myself anything other than that?  A label we throw around, pointing a accusatory finger at others who buy cars to keep in air conditioned garages, depriving 'real' enthusiasts of the joy of those special cars. Many IBers, if they are honest, must admit the same thing.  We have become a bunch of collectors.

I am not there yet, but I suspect that there is no cure other than to sell the car and buy something I am prepared to use as a daily.

Please, tell me I am wrong. 

 

PS - this is country roads NZ style.

[Nige]

You'll discussing financial value of them next.

 

In some ways it's good you don't need to travel much.

[Beaky]

It depends if the lack of mileage is life style related and/or to retain the value in the vehicle probably a combination of both.

As part of my social activities I try and have a drive out once a week in my cars, it maybe just an evening blast around local road, or a few mates going for an early drive on Sunday morning to grab a bacon roll etc.

Additionally in London PCGB R20 region hold 2 local meets a month and I and my mates attend - ACE Cafe and Out East, I'm also a member of a few other local motoring/social club that arrange drive ours, etc.

To drive you need an excuse and a destination!

[Phill]

RB I think you need to accept that NZ roads are not suited to your car. It's a long time since I've been there but I remember that outside the towns the roads were pretty much like your pictures, beautiful but not for sports cars.

Be honest with yourself, there are a lot of other vehicles more fun (and safer) than your Beemer on those roads. You will drive a more suitable car far more often.

[Nige]

A suitable vehicle

https://www.carandclassic.co.uk/car/C1269104

 

 

[Phill]

16 minutes ago, Nige said:

A suitable vehicle

https://www.carandclassic.co.uk/car/C1269104

 

 

Oh yes please, that's something you would never get out of.....

[Nige]

Just think of how all that gravel road rash is going to affect the M3's value!

[World Citizen]

RB, I'm guilty of becoming a collector too, got 7 cars, only 3 on the road and the 2 really fun cars in storage

Been sat on the fence of selling up my 930 and 964 for awhile now.

Haven't used either for years, reasons for still owning both are; I'm a project sort of guy so have the 'build not bought' mind set. Also the lure of a good Euro-trip or mountain road driving trip is still too strong to ignore. Lastly, when they're gone they're gone.

I see in my future a manageable 2 car collection and both will be more useable cars that don't cost a fortune to keep well maintained eg GR Yaris or GR86 and Hilux.

Fun car will be garaged in the mountains so I can get the most enjoyment from it. Exploring car will be kept in the UK, easier to prepare it here for long trips beyond tootling around Europe

You've got some thinking to do, plenty of fun options out there, biggest problem is deciding which one's are best

 

[GimmeShelter]

Whatever you choose, remind yourself not to drive boring cars!  I 'get it' that you may elect to keep the CSL for special trips, or choose not to pebbledash it on semi-unmade roads, but you really must get something distinctive and entertaining that you can blat about in on a daily basis.  It's life affirming.

That said, it being the last day of November, I've wondered about SORNing my IB today, but can't bring myself to be without the sheer fun of going out in it, even if it's going to get stone-chipped and muddy.

Edited November 30, 2021 by GimmeShelter

[Ian Comerford]

It s a special machine so if you don’t need to sell it, don’t.  Just knowing it is sitting there is often sufficient and as Stephen rightly said, once it's gone, it's gone.  

[Richard Bernau]

FYI - not *all* NZ roads are gravel.  Its only the last 4.5 km of that road that is gravel and I drove it very slowly.  Not bragging but if the legals go through, I have just bought a piece of land off that road (log cabin build thread beckons).  My little piece of land just happens to be only a short distance from the base for Rodin cars (NZ super/hyper car maker).  It also happens to be just under a ski area.  With a challenging access road.

The country roads in NZ are some of the best in the world IMHO.  More cambered than Euro roads and generally a fair bit wider and also much better sighted.  The downside is a lack of real elevation changes and rather more lumps and bumps.  CSL is great, but probably too stiff on KWs.

I have ideas for the next garage update, but can't sell anything for the next 16 months, due to import restrictions.  So plenty of time for pondering.

 

But back on point.  What has bought this tongue in cheek collecting thing to a head is having an everyday modern classic.  Driving the W124 Merc as a daily leads me to conclude that if I am not using my special car regularly then I am not sure what the point of having it is.  Unless its just inertia?  Having sold special cars before, I can hand on heart say I haven't had a second backwards thought.  And one of the other problems is having too many cars.  As much as I advocate have specific cars for specific purposes, inevitably that means you use the special one/s less.  Way back when, the 3.2 Carrera was our family car, so it got used for everything and I loved that.  I guess I am saying that if you have a fleet mentality then maybe you ought to regularly get rid of what you don't use?  I am just thinking out loud a bit here.

On a more interesting note, I am happy to take suggestions on what I ought to buy for my log cabin vehicle.  I have a 2 hour drive to the cabin, so I need some comfort, some overtaking, some twisty road handling and to be able to cope with a very steep and snowy, dirt road to the ski field.  That's the criteria.  I have time as the cabin will take 2 yrs to build.  A Subaru Outback 3.0 on all-terrains is probably the 'right' car, but there are about a million of them in NZ, so its far too predictable.   Or, if I could crowbar my wife into a little EV (which would be 100% logical), then I could just have her Allroad.  

I guess like many on here, I am cursed/blessed to spend many hundreds of hours pondering these questions and from time to time, I will share those thoughts (because nobody else will listen)  

[GrahamTompkins]

I don’t think that even in the UK an E46 M3CSL could ever be realistically used as a daily car, it is and will always be a collectors car so I guess having one makes you a collector, like it or not. I guess in the UK opportunities to have a decent drive now and again are significantly better than in NZ so I can understand your thinking. What about the occasional track day ? That may keep the “fun flame” flickering ? 

[World Citizen]

A trophy truck with a ski rack for the log cabin commute win 😍

 

[Mondrian]

Pickup is a great idea and seemingly perfect to explore and take advantage of the terrain NZ has to offer. Reasonably priced, reliable and highly customizable so you could just buy a basic one and take it in any direction you want. Besides you probably have a lot of stuff to shift to & from the lug cabin.

 

[Busybee]

It's the "why not" that would bother me Richard. I'm guessing pace of life must be slower in NZ compared to your previous life near the big smoke? I'm guessing you have more time? Are you looking for a slower less angry car to enjoy on dirt roads? Is damage to the beemer an issue? Is it too valuable to batter on dirt roads?

I'd say get a GR Yaris and go rally stage driving! Keep the beemer for taking the mrs out to lunch in or sell it to make room for fun toys. A rally IB Tuthill's style would be a top car out there. 

 

[Baz]

Quite a conundrum you have got there Richard. As you say the tarmac roads in NZ are pretty good and not as busy as our clogged up roads, some of the mountain roads must be really fun in the CSL. For the log cabin as suggested a pick up truck would be good, Hilux for dependable and supported in NZ or a big bad Aussie truck. A half decent estate car would also make a good load lugger for the build and you wouldn't have to be to precious about it. 2 years ago we drove a good bit of the North island from Wellington up to Bay of Plenty area and also had a night on South Island in a Toyota Corolla hire car.

Baz   

[Richard Bernau]

On 01/12/2021 at 11:51, GrahamTompkins said:

I don’t think that even in the UK an E46 M3CSL could ever be realistically used as a daily car, it is and will always be a collectors car so I guess having one makes you a collector, like it or not. I guess in the UK opportunities to have a decent drive now and again are significantly better than in NZ so I can understand your thinking. What about the occasional track day ? That may keep the “fun flame” flickering ? 

It was my daily apart from the train station in the UK.  The opportunities for driving in NZ are better and easier than the UK - the problem is me!  I am just not out there doing it.

20 hours ago, Mondrian said:

Pickup is a great idea and seemingly perfect to explore and take advantage of the terrain NZ has to offer. Reasonably priced, reliable and highly customizable so you could just buy a basic one and take it in any direction you want. Besides you probably have a lot of stuff to shift to & from the lug cabin.

 

Utes are not cheap in NZ.  A dual cab ute is the great kiwi dream and they are consequently over priced unless you buy new and I don't buy new cars.

Appreciate all the thoughts!  I love the range of comments.

[Bugs 77]

Half my family is in NZ, have driven over most of it now, would love to have a 964 or 993 C4 tucked away at one of the in-laws places when in town, or an IB. Never had the chance to drive those county roads in a Porsche, did most of it all by VW Kombi van in the day.

Subi's are good for what you come across driving around NZ, or I'd have a Quattro Audi of some sort if not a C4 911, I think NZ country is where all these come into their own.

On the collector issue I think there's a lot of sitting around staring at cars at the moment, some really are art forms so that's not so bad, but when mine comes together it will be driven as much as possible, when there's not one there I do feel a bit empty.

[Mondrian]

On 02/12/2021 at 08:18, Richard Bernau said:

Utes are not cheap in NZ.  A dual cab ute is the great kiwi dream and they are consequently over priced unless you buy new and I don't buy new cars.

If you don't mind the looks (post 2016 ie 8th gen are prettier) I would buy a low mileage 7th gen circa 10 yr old model that hasn't been abused as mechanically there isn't much difference to the 8th gen. I got a 2009 model with 150k km (90k miles) and is in very good condition. It's so well made that it feels like a 3-5 yr old car and would have no hesitation on taking it on a 2000 mile safari. I look forward to driving it for a few years and putting on a few hundred thousand kms, apparently engines & major drive gear are good for 400 - 500k kms. Had a quick look on autotrader in NZ and something like mine would be around NZ$22k which is roughly £11k, don't think you get it much cheaper in UK.

 

[johndglynn]

I valued an older M3 and M2 track day car last week -  the owner had just bought a Yaris GR and his BMs were looking like classified ads.  I think maybe we all switch from drivers into cruisers at some stage and that may be the issue rather than not using the appreciating assets. Anyway that scenery looks mega so hat tip on the move home.

[World Citizen]

2 hours ago, Mondrian said:

If you don't mind the looks (post 2016 ie 8th gen are prettier) I would buy a low mileage 7th gen circa 10 yr old model that hasn't been abused as mechanically there isn't much difference to the 8th gen. I got a 2009 model with 150k km (90k miles) and is in very good condition. It's so well made that it feels like a 3-5 yr old car and would have no hesitation on taking it on a 2000 mile safari. I look forward to driving it for a few years and putting on a few hundred thousand kms, apparently engines & major drive gear are good for 400 - 500k kms. Had a quick look on autotrader in NZ and something like mine would be around NZ$22k which is roughly £11k, don't think you get it much cheaper in UK.

 

I'd agree on UK prices too

Drove a new 8th gen with the 2.8 engine, could easily see myself in one doing big miles very comfortably, only thing that puts me of slightly is the size of it, with each new generation comes more super sizing

Prefer the size of my 4Runner but not many rot free ones around so I'd suggest something a bit more modern

[Mondrian]

I think both 7th & 8th gen are around 5.3m but I don't actually feel the size even driving it around town and in small streets however my daily is 4.9m, your LS400 must be around 5m @World Citizen

[Northy]

When does the Rivian arrive in NZ? they look ace and really well thought out. 

[Mondrian]

Can't see EV's being used for proper offroad stuff anytime soon mainly due to range, also most prefer less electronics for variety of reasons such as repairs in remote area. Rivian claim a range of 314 miles based on 21 inch wheels dropping down by 15% to 267 for 20 , neither of which is suitable for offroad. 17 and 15 inch are the popular choices so if we use the same yardstick range could drop well below 200 miles. Mine has a range of 400 miles and was recommended to carry an extra 100L ie over 500 miles of reserve fuel for a 5 day camping/safari trip. Diesels have a range of 600 miles.

Of course all above figures are based on optimal consumption, you carry more weight and push the engine a lot more as well as drop tire pressure down to around 20 psi for gravel or 10 psi for sand, sometimes even less ... so range will drop down, dramatically so. EV's will be ok for urban use or day trips where there are plenty of charging stations but it will be a long while before we see them out in the wild.