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Phill

Phil's CIS to EFI

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Here we go then.........

My first deliberation was where to put the thread. Ignition first so this is the obvious place.

For a number of years this is something I have desired. Throttle bodies look amazing, should save fuel, be more reliable and adaptable and maybe produce some more horsepower. CIS is now ancient and parts can be very expensive to replace. EFI parts are essentially standalone, solid state technology and can be replaced relatively cheaply. This is my rationale and is clearly open to significant debate but I have taken the plunge. 

I do not pretend to know very much about the subject so I have been doing a lot of reading and learning about this stuff is very interesting and keeps me occupied :lol: This will not be a quick process and I don't plan to start installing parts until October-ish to take advantage of the "down" season. In the meantime I am studying and buying. Already my estimated budget of £1000 is blown considerably :o

So here are the starter parts. I know, ignition first but they are just sooooo shiny and pretty I couldn't resist. Manifolds from DanST Engineering. Can't rate Dan too highly, very helpful and friendly.

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How light? When the box arrived this morning I thought there was nothing in it.

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You can't have too many gratuitous shiny aluminium pics..........

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Triumph 955i throttle bodies from Ebay (sorry Kenny but these were cheap ;) ) I have tested the injectors and they click nicely and the throttle position sensors give what appears to be the correct resistance reading.

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Huge amounts to do and learn. More parts have been ordered and brains picked. I shall order the ECU over the weekend.

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Excellent stuff, nice to see the manifolds have angled flanges so the throttle bodies sit vertical.  

Tim Bennett (impmad2000) on DDK is running Triumph stuff on Megasquirt and crank fired.  Might be worth posting your progress on there as well for his input as he's very knowledgeable about these things.

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23 minutes ago, Nige said:

Excellent stuff, nice to see the manifolds have angled flanges so the throttle bodies sit vertical.  

Tim Bennett (impmad2000) on DDK is running Triumph stuff on Megasquirt and crank fired.  Might be worth posting your progress on there as well for his input as he's very knowledgeable about these things.

I have read that thread and I am quite sure I will picking Tim's brains at some point :unsure: he seems to be a bit of a wizz :ani_clapping:

Parts needed for ignition part of project. This list will get longer for sure...

Megasquirt ECU

Trigger wheel, sensor and bracket (likely to be self manufactured)

Coil pack

Plug leads (leaning towards custom made magnecor)

Resistive spark plugs

Lambda sensor boss for exhaust

Wideband Lambda sensor and controller

Various wiring and connectors

Distributor blanking plug

Most of this I think is wiring. Planning is going to be key along with sound connections. The job I'm not looking forward to is getting the crank pulley off. From what I have read this can be a pig to remove. I'm hoping it will be achievable by removing the silencer and engine support brackets to allow  access. I will make a sturdy brace to keep the pulley in place and put my trust in a long breaker bar. This job may well get done sooner rather than later.  I also need to remove a heat exchanger,  find a suitable spot for the Lambda sensor and have the boss welded on. Boss is on order and welder is warned :D

I will keep a running total of costs so the next person can make an informed decision as whether they want to do it or not.

It's all quite fascinating and a little bit exciting.........

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1 hour ago, Phill said:

It's all quite fascinating and a little bit exciting.........

I bet, always good getting stuck into things like this.

How set on using the MS ECU are you? Have you looked about at other systems?

Have you considered dropping the engine to do the conversion? I realise some things are easier with it in the car if you dont have an engine stand (like removing a HE) but a lot of other stuff is much easier when you can get to all sides of the engine.

Also assume you will try to do some sort of before/after comparison? Dyno or dyno app or even maybe just a benchmark of how soon you can get to 70mph from your favourite roundabout.

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1 hour ago, SP72 said:

Good work Phill - have read good things about the Rasant products based on AEM, be interested to see how it works out in comparison.

Unsure if you'll need them, however the parts list and install manual may be useful.

http://rasantproducts.com/porsche-911-engine-management-efi-kit-2-7-3-0-3-2l-with-itbs/

Thanks for that. Some interesting sensors there. I will have to find out where they go. The more sensors the better I think.

24 minutes ago, jevvy said:

I bet, always good getting stuck into things like this.

How set on using the MS ECU are you? Have you looked about at other systems?

Have you considered dropping the engine to do the conversion? I realise some things are easier with it in the car if you dont have an engine stand (like removing a HE) but a lot of other stuff is much easier when you can get to all sides of the engine.

Also assume you will try to do some sort of before/after comparison? Dyno or dyno app or even maybe just a benchmark of how soon you can get to 70mph from your favourite roundabout.

The MS appears to be the cheapest option, all the others seem to be a good couple of hundred more and from what I understand the MS is a good DIY option which is all part of the learning experience.

Sadly I don't have the out of car option due to space. Also this will be in stages, ignition first then fuel so it would mean in out in out, so to speak.

I have had previous dynos done so I will rely on them although they are old so maybe £40 for a run might make a good benchmark - a good idea to be considered. Defo on the timed roundabout runs :revs: Equinox cruise coming up :rally:

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That's very useful, thanks Ian. I've seen a lot of threads but not that one, excellent. A very classy linkage.

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More goodies.

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Coil pack, associated leads and VR sensor. Lambda sensor and controller. Fuel injector and TPS connectors.

All from Trigger Wheels. COM

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Costs so far (not including postage where applicable)

2 X Triumph ITBs                                            £135    ebay

Manifolds                                                        £360    DanSTengineering

Coil pack, leads and VR sensor                      £85      Trigger Wheels

Techedge Lambda controller and sensor        £165    Trigger Wheels

Connectors                                                      £20      Trigger Wheels

Lambda boss for exhaust                                 £5        ebay

 

Total                                                                £770

 

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Good work Phil.  I look at this with a bit of envy but having decided I don't have the time to do it this way I just have to live with it. Good job I have a plan b......

 

Ian

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You may not be so envious once I actually start installing, I'm doing the easy bit at the moment :lol:

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1 hour ago, Ian Comerford said:

Good work Phil.  I look at this with a bit of envy but having decided I don't have the time to do it this way I just have to live with it. Good job I have a plan b......

 

Ian

Carbs?

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I'll be interested to see how you get on. I ran into so many unforeseen problems and that was using a "bolt on" set of PMOs. Maybe it was my naivety, but apart from the physical bolting on they were anything but plug play. It looks like you've got your head around most of it though.

One of the issues that I had was trying to get hoses to connect from the original Porsche fuel lines to the new stuff. I went to 3 different hose manufacturers with examples of the fittings from the car in my hand and they made up hoses they thought were right only for them not to be. It turns out the fittings Porsche used are Porsche specific despite the threads being standard, so be careful. In the end they had to butcher my original fittings and swage those onto the lines with new collars. If you run into any headscratchers then feel free to ask me. If there is an issue to be had in going EFI then I guarantee I will have hit it while getting my install right. Good luck.

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Thanks for the heads up on that Kenny. I have no doubt I will be picking your brains when the time comes.

I just pulled the trigger on the ECU from ExtraEFI, another £500 of commitment. I will post a pointless picture of it when it arrives :D

Edited by Phill

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Another part arrives.

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For £11 it is the best bit of engineering ever!

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For what it's worth, neither of the people who mapped my car wanted the MAP signal, despite me plumbing one in. They just just used air temp, head temp, TPS and of course engine position/speed. On the PMOs there was a large tapping on #2 cylinder manifold for the brake servo. I did use the manifold absolute pressure to balance the fuel pressure regulator, but I now need to remove the MAP sensor and rubber pipe to it to tidy up the engine bay.

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You are quite right, my tuner said it wasn't needed too but I had ordered it ages ago. It looks so pretty though.....

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Minor updates.

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Exhaust is off (only stainless steel allowed in my kitchen :D ) and now with the welder having the lambda boss welded on. Will be back and refitted in time for the Equinox Cruise.

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Gratuitous Megasquirt picture. That is an awful lot of wires......

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These filters arrived from China today. At £5 a pair you can't go wrong. I will worry about trumpets etc at the very end, if I have any money left.

 

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:lol: the copious amount of oil on it kept it clean.

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3 hours ago, Phill said:

These filters arrived from China today. At £5 a pair you can't go wrong.

You are a brave man, filters protect the engine!

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Phill, those filters are cra*p - wouldn't consider these suitable for a lawnmower!

Your build deserves better than eBay garbage. With fuel systems if you don't get the right parts then you never establish a datum any you spend months chasing your tail.

 

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