Flat 6 Posted May 3, 2016 Share Posted May 3, 2016 I bought this ’78 SC 18 months ago as a runabout while my ‘73T was being restored. Unfortunately some ‘tidying’ has turned into more like a minor restoration so I thought I’d share this one with you IB’ers. Bought with eyes wide open. The most immediate issue was an engine that only ran on three cylinders, evidence of rust at the front bumper hangers and patchwork repairs on the b-pillars/sill/kidney bowls. On the upside, the interior was nice, the heater worked and the tape player didn’t chew up my cassettes. So, first stop was Johnny Holland at Unit 11 Porsche in Warrington who used to look after my old SC when I lived in Manchester. Johnny was quickly able to diagnose a separated cam chain which is apparently unusual – he thinkS it was due to poor assembly some years earlier when the engine ‘benefited’ from a top end rebuild. So, separated chain = bent valves and since we couldn’t be sure about any of the engine I went for a full rebuild of both the engine and gearbox. I can’t recommend Johnny highly enough. He says it how it is, gets the job done in good order and the engine and gearbox are sweet. Johnny also got it MOT’d and I picked it up in Jan ’15 for the trip back to my home in Co. Down, N.Ireland. I had a bit of time to kill on my way to the ferry in Holyhead so drove up over Snowdonia in dark, misty weather and stopped off at a hotel for a long lunch. Tip no.1 of many – turn your bloody lights off! At least I had a nice warm hotel bar to wait in! Anyway, the rest of the trip went smoothly and we were home for late evening. I must admit it was great to be back in SC ownership again – they just feel so solid. A completely different experience from the ’73 2.4 which seems lighter and more fragile for some reason (or maybe it feels fragile because it’s worth so much more??). Here’s some shots of what a long road trip does to a classic Porsche in January! Love those original periscope washers, not that they worked at that stage. Everything else was working fine so I enjoyed the car for most of last year. Mechanically it is fantastic but every time I washed it I was reminded about a few minor rust areas and I knew those issues with the front bumper hangers and poor kidney bowl repairs were lurking so I decided to take it off the road in September and start in on a ‘tidy up’. More to come... Al Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flat 6 Posted May 3, 2016 Author Share Posted May 3, 2016 So, some of the issues to be deal with. Minor bubbling at rear wing lower edges Painted over panel joins Rear screen lower corner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R2D2 Posted May 3, 2016 Share Posted May 3, 2016 Nice early SC there mate! Love the old school trim. Enjoy! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mondrian Posted May 3, 2016 Share Posted May 3, 2016 I have a soft spot for silver ones, looking forward to the end result. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sjwright944 Posted May 3, 2016 Share Posted May 3, 2016 Looks really cool especially in silver Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Gander Posted May 3, 2016 Share Posted May 3, 2016 Agree Al with your comment about the lightness of the '73 2.4.I had a '72 2.4S (the one that Quintin Wilson drove in that program with ....forgotten her name at the moment....ah, was it Jodi Kid?). Anyway, it was a lovely car but drove a bit like a Beetle, very light and skittish,,especially in high winds. I've never driven the much lauded 2.4 RS, but as it's almost the same spec'd car other than an additional 20 BHP and a few other changes which I doubt would make it that much different to drive than the more common 2.4S? Possibly a little bit sharper and 'zingy'? Maybe I'm wrong, but somehow hype and smaller build numbers together with journalistic excess, combine to elevate it to God-like status. Had I kept the 'yellow Beetle'!, it certainly would be a very nice pension fund......certainly could not afford to risk driving it now! Regards, David. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flat 6 Posted May 3, 2016 Author Share Posted May 3, 2016 I remember the guy I bought the car off trying to tell me that the line of rust on the inside of the front inner wings was a minor issue that would disappear with a good sanding off and some fresh paint. Had I no experience of old 911s I might just have believed him. So, front wings off to have a good look at those bumper hangers How can a company with the experience of Porsche design in such an effective muck trap. This car will have the SVP/IB arch liners. And the other side? Much the same story… I thought maybe this side wasn’t as bad…. More on that later. And then there’s the previous repairs to the kidney bowl and b-pillar areas…doesn’t look too bad from the top which is why I was able to live with it for nine months. But we all know what the lack of defined panel overlaps in this area mean! This is what it looks like from behind! The other side was much the same. It’s just all gotta go. And this is when the real work starts! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mean in green Posted May 4, 2016 Share Posted May 4, 2016 I remember the guy I bought the car off trying to tell me that the line of rust on the inside of the front inner wings was a minor issue that would disappear with a good sanding off and some fresh paint. Had I no experience of old 911s I might just have believed him. The same guy who was happy to paint over most of the exterior seals... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nige Posted May 4, 2016 Share Posted May 4, 2016 All the usual IB rot spots. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fuchs915 Posted May 4, 2016 Share Posted May 4, 2016 He was right, it does disappear following a bit of sanding. It completely disappears, leaving a nice hole to put some new metal in. Liking the approach, keep it up. Kevin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flat 6 Posted May 4, 2016 Author Share Posted May 4, 2016 Front left bumper hanger came off pretty cleanly with a spot weld drill bit. The panel has been cleaned off and treated a couple of times with Bilt Hamber Deox gel which leaves a clean bare metal finish. I then put on a coat of Aquasteel which will keep it protected until it’s time for Zinc primer and Epoxy Mastic once the repair is done. Now the extent of the problem can be seen clearly. The repair is needed along the line of the top edge of the bumper hanger. Cutting out is the easy bit… Fabricating the repair was more of a challenge because of the multiple curves but got there in the end. And welded in place… To finish, the cleaned and treated metal was given a coat of Zinc primer (Bilt Hamber Electrox), then two coats of epoxy mastic, also from Bilt Hamber. The final stage will be to re-apply stonechip and then body colour plus lacquer. Similar job on the other side so I'll move on to the b-pillars etc next. Al. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flat 6 Posted May 7, 2016 Author Share Posted May 7, 2016 So, onto the b-pillars and kidney bowls The b-pillar/sill/rear wing area had been beautifully shaped with fillers. Given the amount of time they must have spent shaping and welding in patches and then shaping fillers it would probably have been cheaper to fit proper panels. But these may not have been available when this work was done. Filler removed… Then had to get stuck in with a cutting disk… More dodgy patchwork… It did actually look kind of structurally sound – suppose I could have cleaned those welds up and closed it back up again but since I had no idea what it looked like in behind it had to come off… Looks nastier than it was. Structurally fine underneath and this also allowed me get a good look at the inside of the sills which were good. Much work later with grinder and spot weld drill… I have been cleaning off rusted metalwork and treating with Bilt Hamber products as I go. Their deox rust removal gel works best when left overnight – they recommend putting cling film over it to stop it drying out. It’s a royal PITA but is very effective so worth doing. I kept the top part of the RHS b-pillar but wanted to be sure there was no rust in there so it got the treatment… It does leave a very clean surface to put the high zinc primer onto. The b-pillar was being cut again just above the lock catch… The sill area on the RHS was much like the left but sound underneath the patchwork. The kidney bowl on this side looked good before it was cleaned off. Then the holes appeared! After a lot more work cleaning off, treating and prepping the surface it was time for some new metalwork. Time to hand over to the pro bodywork restorer! New wing panel was butt welded in – one spot at a time to make sure there was no warping… I used panels from Porsche and Restoration Design for these repairs. The newly repaired areas were coated with epoxy mastic before closing. These were then coated again from the inside. Then the thinnest possible layer of fillers was required to get a perfect finish… As part of the complete bare metal respray the whole area then got two coats of epoxy primer and two coats of standard 2-pack primer. This will finished off with 2 coats of base colour and two of lacquer. All that hard work pays off in the end! So that’s the main repairs completed. Could have stopped there but since I’d come this far I wanted the rest of the car to be at the same standard so I’ve been on a ‘war on rust’ campaign. More to follow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ALEX P Posted May 7, 2016 Share Posted May 7, 2016 Nice work, love a bodywork thread Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Posted May 7, 2016 Share Posted May 7, 2016 Nice going, it will be great when finished Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3 point 2 Posted May 8, 2016 Share Posted May 8, 2016 looking great, whens it going to be finished? Will Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flat 6 Posted May 8, 2016 Author Share Posted May 8, 2016 Hey Will, Progress depends on how busy I am with the necessary evil of the day job...quiet for the next couple of weeks so hopefully will get a lot of spanner work done. I think bolting stuff on and putting the front and rear screens back in will be the easy bit. Not looking forward to rebuilding the doors and there are a few fiddly trim bits to do to achieve target standard. June? This year? Main thing is I'm really enjoying it. Spend several hours today just cleaning and finishing external rubber. Even managed to BBQ while doing it! Al. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flat 6 Posted December 28, 2016 Author Share Posted December 28, 2016 Hello again, just the seven months since the last update…pity we have to have a day job to pay for all this 911 fun eh? XLO came back from the paint shop in June - I think I said I would have the car back together again by the end of June? Aye right… The problem / challenge comes when you see the quality of the exterior paint job and then think ‘I can’t leave the underside of the car like that…’ I had already started to clean up the underside before the car went for paint. I’ve been careful to remove any trace of rust using different sizes of grinder and drill mounted wire brushes. The area is then degreased with Bilt Hamber’s cleaning solution and then treated with either their deox gel or rust convertor/surface prep (Hydrate 80). I can’t stress the importance of degreasing the surface before applying any sort of rust treatment or surface coating. For years I have been cleaning off rusty bits and applying different forms of treatment only to have these fail (albeit sometimes after many years). Pete Hamber at Bilt Hamber explained the obvious – metal prepped with a wire brush, however carefully, might look clean but it isn’t and the rust treatment just sits on top of the greasy surface rather than getting to work on the rust. It’s a messy business though – so much easier in the summer when the car can be put up on axle stands outside. Alternatively, you can do it inside on smaller areas – I’ve nicked my wife’s large plastic tray that came with her oven cleaning kit…it’s about 3 feet by two feet so catches most of the water washing off things like suspension. Front suspension getting the treatment: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flat 6 Posted December 28, 2016 Author Share Posted December 28, 2016 Inside the front and rear wings was very original, perhaps due to someone having coated the silver with some form of black underseal what must have been many years ago. But up close you could see that there were multiple tiny crazes in the finish. These were mainly where fixings broke the skin or where there were spot welds. I went over the surface inch by inch and ground out any breaks in the surface down to the metal and then treated. I’d forgotten how slow photobucket is…I’ll do a mass upload and come back to this later…. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richot1989 Posted December 28, 2016 Share Posted December 28, 2016 Hi Flat 6, Great work and update - keep the pics coming! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flat 6 Posted December 30, 2016 Author Share Posted December 30, 2016 For any of you readers buying a 911 for the first time, the area behind the oil tank was particularly messy, although it was only surface rust. Following treatment, the first layer of protection is Electrox high zinc primer (can't get that photo to work...) When the car then went for paint this area was further coated with two layers of epoxy mastic, more stone chip and then body colour. So it ends up looking very nice indeed! The observant among you will notice the broken captive nut that the rear wing extension bolts to. Man was I annoyed then I noticed that…had to drill that out afterwards and reapply all those layers again! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Henry Posted December 30, 2016 Share Posted December 30, 2016 I expect the observant noticed you hadn'nt painted behind the rubber shock washer , good job though always good knowing you are top of the old tin worm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3literpwr Posted January 2, 2017 Share Posted January 2, 2017 So, onto the b-pillars and kidney bowls The b-pillar/sill/rear wing area had been beautifully shaped with fillers. Given the amount of time they must have spent shaping and welding in patches and then shaping fillers it would probably have been cheaper to fit proper panels. But these may not have been available when this work was done. Filler removed… Then had to get stuck in with a cutting disk… More dodgy patchwork… It did actually look kind of structurally sound – suppose I could have cleaned those welds up and closed it back up again but since I had no idea what it looked like in behind it had to come off… Looks nastier than it was. Structurally fine underneath and this also allowed me get a good look at the inside of the sills which were good. Much work later with grinder and spot weld drill… I have been cleaning off rusted metalwork and treating with Bilt Hamber products as I go. Their deox rust removal gel works best when left overnight – they recommend putting cling film over it to stop it drying out. It’s a royal PITA but is very effective so worth doing. I kept the top part of the RHS b-pillar but wanted to be sure there was no rust in there so it got the treatment… It does leave a very clean surface to put the high zinc primer onto. The b-pillar was being cut again just above the lock catch… The sill area on the RHS was much like the left but sound underneath the patchwork. The kidney bowl on this side looked good before it was cleaned off. Then the holes appeared! After a lot more work cleaning off, treating and prepping the surface it was time for some new metalwork. Time to hand over to the pro bodywork restorer! New wing panel was butt welded in – one spot at a time to make sure there was no warping… I used panels from Porsche and Restoration Design for these repairs. The newly repaired areas were coated with epoxy mastic before closing. These were then coated again from the inside. Then the thinnest possible layer of fillers was required to get a perfect finish… As part of the complete bare metal respray the whole area then got two coats of epoxy primer and two coats of standard 2-pack primer. This will finished off with 2 coats of base colour and two of lacquer. All that hard work pays off in the end! So that’s the main repairs completed. Could have stopped there but since I’d come this far I wanted the rest of the car to be at the same standard so I’ve been on a ‘war on rust’ campaign. More to follow. Did you happen to find that the Restoration design fender sections had much a much softer radius on the lock post edge? I recently bought one for my project and the edge is far softer then the original unit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flat 6 Posted January 2, 2017 Author Share Posted January 2, 2017 I expect the observant noticed you hadn'nt painted behind the rubber shock washer , good job though always good knowing you are top of the old tin worm. Well spotted Henry! Those have since been removed and the area behind treated and recoated, although they were so well stuck to the bracket that there wasn't actually any rust behind them. 3literpwr - I ended up getting three RHS sections from RD Europe before I was happy with the fit. In the end Marcel advised that these were all hand made and I think not by RD in Canada. They had changed source and the last one I got was a good fit overall. I was happy with the sharpness of the pressing. If you're not so happy with what you've got I would go straight back to Marcel and let him know. I have found them very very keen to get things right. More to come when the hangover clears... Al. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flat 6 Posted January 3, 2017 Author Share Posted January 3, 2017 OK, so the photos I wanted to use of the zinc primer work on a different laptop... I have regular conversations with myself and others about restoration versus rebuild etc. At what point does a car warrant being stripped to bare shell and dipped? (and is dipping a bad idea in the first place...). My thinking on this car was that so much of the original underside was intact that a careful manual process of cleaning off, inspection, grinding out and treatment of affected areas is the right route to take. I suppose time will tell but with another six layers on top of this I'm thinking everything is as rust proof as it can be made. On top of the zinc went two-pack epoxy mastic, then more stone chip and finally body colour... A small repair had to be done above the cut-out for the oil tank where there is a little shelf. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flat 6 Posted January 3, 2017 Author Share Posted January 3, 2017 The car went for paint in January and was finished in March this year, a pretty quick turnaround given that he is also working on my 2.4T. Here are some shots of the work as it progressed. Too many previous layers of paint = removal of all layers down to bare metal… OK, so a bonnet for a (guess) got in among my panels… And then it all has to go on again, starting with epoxy primer, as per recommendations over on those DDK master restoration projects… That then had to be masked off as the epoxy mastic was put on the inner wings… Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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